Karachi vs Lahore

Image008.jpgThe debate seems to be as old as the two remarkably different yet important cities themselves. Last time I was here in Lahore, it was that fateful October of 1999 that saw Musharraf taking over the power from Nawaz Sharif. Incidentally, six years later, my next visit to the city is around the same time of the year and, more interestingly, with similar but more interesting times in our national politics.

But there is so much more to life than politics – like roads, trees, rickshaws, license plates, traffic policemen and building s’ heights.

It is normal for a Karachite who has not been to Lahore for a long time to indulge in the almost involuntary comparison between the two cities of pride. While there are so many things that stand out between the two – from the color of the sand to that of the traffic policemen’s uniform here is what I noted in the first 10 minutes on the roads of Lahore:

Image011.jpgThe motorbikes are getting standardized license plates. Not only are these bigger and clearer, in due course of time when most of these motorbikes are switched to the new format, they should help in reducing the problems associated with the make-at-home number plates that are used in Karachi.

The rickshaws have their rare unnecessarily exposed. I spotted the make of the chassis to be that of Vespa and hence this seems like more of a ‘city trademark’ than a technical necessity. Their cousins in Karachi are more demure.

I also spotted the traffic policemen equipped – so logically – with a headset to let them talk on their radios while controlling the tidal flows of the city which somehow also appears to be relatively saner than that in Karachi. They looked smart. The headset, I am sure, costs nothing, but it saves the hassle of having one hand constantly engaged in using the radios – a fate that finds its way to the traffic police in Karachi.

I did not travel in the old city except for once during these 48 hours. But I traveled for work in the new city over a hundred kilometers and kept on waiting without any success for a bumpy road – or even a patch like that. I was, honestly, feeling somewhat uneasy on the roads that were smooth and well marked. May be I deserve the bad roads that seems to be part of my life back in Karachi. I don’t know.

And finally, like an envious Karachite used to to live in a jungle of concrete, I was pleasantly struck by the greenery here and at the same time saddened by the lack of same back at home. But the even bigger surprise was a banner put up by the local Government that talked about planting more trees and associating it with the environment. I was duly impressed. The high rises residential apartments that dot every corner of Karachi without any fail were hard to spot in Lahore.

I must return back to Karachi tonight. I wish I had a magic copier of sorts that would let me copy – in full color, shape and form the good things I spotted here and paste that all back onto Karachi. But then, I am not sure if that sudden change would pose a health hazard to the fifteen million Karachiites who are used to of braving the inhuman behemoth Karachi has become.

80 Comments so far

  1. Notonebuttwo (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 7:30 pm

    All you said may be true and then some. People in Lahore have been living in calmer saner conditions and have had their pani / bijli taken care of and so have come to the conclusion that they have left Karachi somewhere in the Dark ages. The fact that an ordinary citizen is less harassed there (as his basic utility needs are met) shows that perhaps lahore has been working hard at making its citizens happier. Also the roads appear less chaotic, (though personally I cannot compete with the donkey carts el all). All in all… though I love Karachi, I think we should acknowledge that Lahore is doing something very right!


  2. T Khan (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 7:35 pm

    The very idea of comparing these contrasting cities is absurd.

    Not even your octroi collected at Superhighway is imbursed to Karachi forget the rest of 60% National tax revenues the city generates.

    Lahore is rich beacuse Karachi is poor! understand this notion and live with it.


  3. Salman A. (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 8:17 pm

    Lahore is kind of loyal to Pakistan while Karachi is only loyal to Altaf Hussain.

    Lahore is a clear winner.


  4. SELF (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 8:47 pm

    TM, please remember that while the population of Sindh is less than Punjab, Sindh gets a larger share of Budget. Now, where does all this extra money goes, that is another story.

    I believe there is too much tera-mera in Sindh and while it keeps the populus confused and not sure of who to blame and for what, it gives the top guys on most sides political stature and more often than not also some healthy earnings. In Karachi in particular there is too much emphasises on individual groups than the city itself.


  5. kaduna2003 (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 8:56 pm

    The Karachi city budget is 8 times that of lahore. You may check the figures yourself if you want. They are available on the internet.

    However, the local government in karachi is so corrupt that it eats up all that money. Lahore has less money but it is spent wisely. As long as karachi local govt is managed by the same corrupt leaders, the city will stay down in the dumps.


  6. Faisal (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 9:17 pm

    I was there for a day last month, visiting after seven years. Lahore’s come far. Very far. I can’t say much about the people, my interaction was very limited considering how i was there for just a day. However, in terms of civic infrastructure, Lahoris have it very good and i was impressed by the overall conditions. Of course, there’s a long way to go for Lahore, Karachi and Pakistan…But Punjab seems well on its way.


  7. DB9 (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 9:40 pm

    What happened to that mega project of worlds tallest building in Karachi? Did it start?


  8. SELF (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 10:23 pm

    Can we really take a chance after all those mega projects dropping like flies?


  9. Sufi (unregistered) on September 11th, 2007 @ 10:34 pm

    What many of you have failed to notice is that Lahore has been in a constant state of up gradation for the last 17 years (that I have been observing it). Karachi had been one of the most neglected cities in the world (if I remember correctly, it was voted the most neglected mega-city of the world with a lot of untapped potential by Times in 2003).

    Though Karachi’s budget might be higher than that of Lahore, so is its population and covered area and revenue generated comparatively. Only recently have all these development projects being started in Karachi (only after local government system was introduced in 2000? )
    So 7 years of ICU (intensive care unit) progress vs 17 years of development (major contributors are the Sharif Brotheraans), I think Karachi is doing good and given that the progress continues as it is right now, Karachi will be a more livable place as time goes by. InshaAllah.


  10. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 1:21 am

    @ Kduna2003!
    I Disagree!
    the budget of Karachi is more than Lahore ! but the proportion by which Lahore receives the budget is much higher than Karachi ! like the percentage population of police is also higher !

    If there are 10X people in Lahore then Karachi has more 100X by the proportion Karachi should get more than 15 times the budget of Lahore, (cause the larger the city get larger and more complex the infrastructure becomes).

    Our Sharif barathrans spent three years busy only in beautifying Lahore!!!
    While Karachi was left at the mercy of land grabbers!

    Lahore has been going regular upgradation!, while living in Karachi we can only see developments during the NAzim Tenures! like When Farooq Sattar was Nazim, NAimatullah Khaan Sahab , and the latest entry Mustafa Kamal,

    FOR GOD SAKES !! KARACHI’S POPULATION IS CLOSE TO 10% OF THE COUNTRY , GENERATING 70% OF GDP/INCOME TAXES, WHILE GETTING BACK LESS THAN 5% !!!!


  11. Kaduna2003 (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:00 am

    Karachi Population = 16 Million
    Lahore Polutation = 9 million.

    The issue is not that the population of karachi is larger. Karachi gets extra budget to cover that.
    The issues instead is that the karachi politicians are corrupt to the core and prefer to send the money abroad instead of spending it on the city. If they had spend the money as lahore had, you have a karachi that is the pride of pakistan and probably one of the best cities in Asia.

    Instead, it is in the interest of the politicians to NOT develop karachi and thus keep the karachi vote bank in their pocket. There is no difference betweeen the karachi politicians and the waderas. They survive on misery.

    I do no mean to cause any offence but that is the honest truth. And until the residents of karachi start asking where the money allocated to the city goes, Karachi will stay the dump it is.


  12. Kashif (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:17 am

    I have been to Lahore recently after a gap of 5 years and I have seen many changes. Lahore is expanding for sure and for worse. Issues like power breakdowns, traffic jams, street crimes etc are increasing. However, the new roads are better than Karachi and wear-tear isn’t as common as here.

    IMHO main reason of development work being successful in Punjab is the symmetry between provincial and district governments. As both of them are being managed by single party, its easier of people to coordinate with less bad blood between them. However, here we always have urdu-sindhi / urban-rural issue. Also, as the leaders of PML-Q base in Pakistan, most of their kick-backs and commissions are reinvested in the country, while in our case its being sent abroad.


  13. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:20 am

    ok ! so Kaduna!
    don’t you see the scale of development work that has been going on in Karachi since 2002????

    Have you ever heard of phrase !”PATCH IN TIME SAVES NINE”

    Fortunately for Lahore, this was implemented ! Unfortunately for KArachi ! this wasnt done ! the repair work and up gradation wasnt done with the passage of time !
    this is the main problem !


  14. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:25 am

    @ KAshif !
    the flow of private money has never been the problem in KArachi, (the one you are referring to)

    Karachi had problem of flow of public funds! which has certainly been improving lately !


  15. BitterTruth (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:36 am

    Huge cities are always problematic. The strategy of developed countries adopt is to develop smaller cities and keep population distributed. If everybody will continue to head towards Karachi, things will never improve. There should be more development in smaller cities.


  16. bluemax (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:50 am

    Syed Johny you are right on target. Examples are Karachi Mass Transit program and Northern/Southern Bypasses. These were planned in early 80′s (someone please correct me if I am wrong). Why it took 20 years to get them started … no funds. Local and provincial govts cant raise 100% funds for such mega projects. Former nazim, Naimatullah Khan, said on TV that federal govt did not provide bank guarantee for the Mass Transit program so it had to be shelved. How can one compare two cities when there exists such bias?


  17. V (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 5:45 am

    @TM: Don’t tell me you didn’t even spot a single one of those new 4-stroke smoke-free noise-less CNG rikshaws that come equipped with left/right indicators and horn (yes, they honk!) that have a key-ignition system? They’re all over the city – and the government is gradually phasing out the older ones.

    @BitterTruth: You are so right about developing smaller cities to lessen the burden on cities like Karachi and Lahore.


  18. zee (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 8:22 am

    SALMAN A.: Lahore is LOYAL to Pakistan? Tell me you are kidding, tell me you kid me amigo! TELL ME!

    I can’t wait to see DOCTOR involve MQM in this post too :D


  19. zee (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 8:25 am

    TOTALL AGREE WITH BLUEMAX! Well said brother!


  20. Obi Wan Kenobi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 10:00 am

    I can tell you one difference b/w Karachiites and Lahoris and most people abroad will agree with that. When Karachiite introduce his Lahori friend to his family, he will say that this guy is also from “Pakistan” and he works with me and blah blah while Lahori will always introduce Karachhite as this guy is from “Karachi” and he works with me and blah blah … Small thing but goes long way.


  21. Emm Aay (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 11:23 am

    In my opinion one of the problem of Karachi is multi level, multi cities and multi province people are here and settled here like Afghans, Pathans and many others thus creating different mind level also there is also the concept of sheep walk is here(i dont know about Lahore) if one breaks rule the others also follow the same pattern.

    As far as Local government is concern no one wants to keep his city dirty i mean they are also like us they not get positive response from citizens as they should.

    Mustafa Kamal has done remarkable job in solving karachi problem he is a dynamic person with lot of idea’s.

    my suggestion to all my pakis is please do remain in their domain, and put extra effort to complete his job.

    Thanks

    EmmAay


  22. Adnan Siddiqi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 11:30 am

    Karachi has been victim of (Punjabi|pahstoon|Mohajir) terrorism for long time. Karachi got started ruining from the day when Khan saab decided to take away status of Capital and built the biggest encroachment in Pakistan which is called Islamabad. Musharraf and Co give excuse of “illegal construction” of Lal masjid massacre. I would consider him man of his words if he shifts entire population of ISB somewhere else and blow up the entire region which was built on “Shamshan ghats” and jungles illegally. The way islamabad was established is very much similar to Israel. Atleast Israelites *paid* money to arabs.

    anyways, so punjabi gardi got started from the era of Ayub but then Ayub and his mates were outsiders. Sind’s own “sons” that is Sindhis and Mohajirs were not less cunning. WHen Bhutto came, he did nothing. The only notable(i didn’t mean Positive) thing which I hear about Bhuto and Karachi are casinos. Later Zia came in power, you can’t expect anything constructive by a martial law administrator.

    in late 80s PPP came in power and then we heard about MQM. Genuine Mohajirs(not kids like who whine on this forum today) would agree that Altaf got popularity due to his agenda against feudalism and to protect Urdu speaking community in Pakistan . URdu speaking community which was supposed to be most learned community in late 80s supported Altaf by every means because Altaf touched the sensitive issues about mohajirs which have been neglecting since ayub era. Quota system, giving jobs to Mohajors, killing feudalism etc etc.

    MQM got in power in PPP era, what was done? nothing. MQM was new so they didn’t know corruption tactics but they also didn’t do anything for the community. Instead of stengthining mohajirs, they strengthened the party and Altaf by various means. Sindhis like Palejo,MUmtaz bhutto were already against this party so it was impossible that MQM could do anything in interior sind.

    In 90s, we experienced Operation and it just changed everything. What happened next was discussed several times here. 90s operation and then Bhata khori and other ghunda gardi by MQM militants was enough for MQM supporters to quit Altaf. Later “Kachra” type people joined the party and made it more worst. Same kachra we see today on this forum as well who support MQM ignorantly.

    Pathan mafia was not less pathetic for Karachi. How they have occupied most of Karachi stuff in the name of Transport mafia and others is not a hidden secret. MQM with all power couldn’t act upon a single point of their manifesto. Infact quota system was strengthened further in their era.

    On other hand Punjab govt never brought personal differences in the middle and every govt worked for the betterment of Punjab. Even in Zia era, the “son” of Zia that is nawaz sharif kept trying to do for Lahore. when he become PM , his brother did tremendous work in Lahore. So whether it was PPP govt or PML-N or Q, everyone put punjab first than anything while in Sind “sons of Karachi” put altaf first than anyone else. Stupidity what else.

    Now we don’t even have excuse(which is genuine) that Karachi was ruined by “Big Brother” while our own mohajir rulers screwed it up badly.


  23. Zeba (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 1:47 pm

    The Basic thing is – The Punjab Govt is NOT DIVIDED on issue of Punjab development.

    Whereas SINDH Govt is divided all of its issues be it development or racism.


  24. Cy (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:03 pm

    Lahore is like a breath of fresh air for a Karachiite no doubt. But it too has many problems – the present govt. has chopped down trees with a vengeance on the mall, has given the go-ahead to all sorts of dubious high rises, and all sorts of other ill-advised projects.

    The Karachi of old looked good, too. What Lahoris need to learn from Karachi is that if you don’t fight right from the start, things rapidly go to hell.


  25. Bilal Rashid (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:43 pm

    Look at yourselves .. its a post about one guys recent visit to Lahore and his personal feelings about it .. and somehow it has turned into a geo political battle .. This my friends is exactly why we have soo much unrest in this country .. Calm Down and try opening your hearts ..


  26. SELF (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 2:55 pm

    Normally I ignore idiots specially the religious mentally retarded ones, but reluctantly one exception

    “anyways, so punjabi gardi got started from the era of Ayub”

    Ayub KHAN was NOT Punjabi…idiot.


  27. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:06 pm

    Just to correct someone, Lahore Rapid Mass Transit is being planned and enivisioned with the help of loan grants by the World Bank and consultants from Hong Kong. There is no Federal Government involved in this project.

    Bilal is absolutely right, this is how we quarrel on claiming our respective city to be better than any other and forgetting that we all belong to one Pakistan. We can be better off only when think and progress as one nation and eradicate all evils including bad-governance, corrupt leaders, extremists and fundamentalists from our society as a whole.


  28. SELF (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:13 pm

    “In my opinion one of the problem of Karachi is multi level, multi cities and multi province people are here and settled here like Afghans, Pathans and many others”

    Many cities are like that and not least Lahore which has approx 20% pushtun/afghan population, but you have got to travel outside Karachi to know this.


  29. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:21 pm

    I must also mention, when someone associates development of Lahore or the rest of the Punjab to Punjabi Leaders, they forget that Bhuttos were not Punjabi.

    I’ve been to Larkana, and that too during Benazir’s tenure just to witness a poor, underdeveloped, overgrown dirty village, nothing else. They didn’t have a single proper English medium school in Larkana then.

    Was she low on funds to develop her own city when her party was in power??


  30. SELF (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:24 pm

    PS: Just because they are not fighting each other all the time, in Lahore does not mean there aren’t many ethnic groups there.


  31. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:37 pm

    @Self: Very true! You can travel through any street in Lahore and find every second household from some other part of the country.

    We’ve Kashmiris, Pakhtuns, Afghans, Siraikis, Sikhs!


  32. Adnan Siddiqi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:37 pm

    Self: I had forgot that we have people on this forum who needs elaboration at hight level due to imaginary dumbness in them.

    Where on earth I said Ayub was Punjabi? Wht I said that establishment of a seperate state was a motive to protect Punjab.

    Musharraf is MOHAJIR but which community he was protecting not a hidden secret.

    Hasan, its all about loyalty. Punjab rulers atleast have loyalty with Punjab which is not something true with Sind rulers.


  33. Adnan Siddiqi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 3:45 pm

    Bilal, if you are targeting me then you are mistaken. I clearly condemned my own Mohajir community as well. Talking about facts doesn’t mean we are being racist or fighting typical punjabi vs non-punjabi thing.


  34. Bilal Rashid (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 4:11 pm

    mere dost i am TARGETTING nobody .. i do not want to Target anybody .. I dont want anybody to target Anybody.. relax


  35. SELF (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 4:23 pm

    “We’ve Kashmiris, Pakhtuns, Afghans, Siraikis, Sikhs!”

    Not to mention urdu speakers. Many of my friends in college etc were urdu speaking..I don’t know why, it just happened…and we loved each other…never an iota of disrespect for each other. As we say in Punjabi..its Karachi’s water that has problem. :)

    btw I wanted to ask TM if he met any “allar mutyaar” in Lahore :) but discussion went the wrong way from start…


  36. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 4:34 pm

    ‘allar mutyaar’ lol!


  37. bluemax (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 4:49 pm

    @Hassan Mubarak, “Lahore Rapid Mass Transit is being planned and enivisioned with the help of loan grants by the World Bank and consultants from Hong Kong. There is no Federal Government involved in this project.”.

    Local and provincial govts are not allowed to deal directly with foreign donor agencies without federal govt’s involvement.


  38. bluemax (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 5:21 pm

    On the World Bank site, “Pakistani Government” is listed under the “Public Agencies” column for Lahore Light Rail project.

    http://www.worldbank.org/transport/ports/excon/rail.xls


  39. Bilal Rashid (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 5:56 pm

    Bluemax seriously you had nothing better to do then lookup the worldbank website and find out if Pakistani Government was listed under the Public Agencies column for the Lahore Rail Project .. i say One thing to that my friend .. Get yourself a Life .. you desprately need one


  40. Sufi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 6:13 pm

    WOW, I knew this topic was too sensitive for some people on the blog.


  41. Adnan Siddiqi (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 6:36 pm

    how a Mutyar could be “Alhar”- Should it not be Mutyari? :-)

    sorry, I don’t know Punjabi :-)


  42. kaduna2003 (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 9:32 pm

    Example 1: Karachi mass transit system blocked due to land struggle. Karachi politicians want their corruption commission. Fed govt asks karachi to get its act together:
    http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=2007%5C01%5C05%5Cstory_5-1-2007_pg7_14

    Example 2:Fed govt planned to develop two island cities with the help of dubai companies. Total investment $40Billion. Karachi politicians want their corruption commission. So project blocked.

    Im willing to bet that while karachi’s politicians send money abroad, the lahore mass transit system will be up and running. And then karachi politicians will cry and point fingers and ask for more votes from karachi people and then send even more money abroad.

    And so the cycle repeats.


  43. bluemax (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 11:17 pm

    Bilal Rashid, I was taught that whenever you claim that your statement is a fact then give references. Just like many other “more intelligent than thou” ppl, you simply assumed that I searched the World Bank site. No did not. As I was waiting for other sites to load, I just googled and it came up on the first page. With Google Toolbar installed, I found what I was looking for with just 4 mouse clicks in 10-15 seconds. So next time try not to be a “LAKEER KA FAQEER” and use technology.


  44. bluemax (unregistered) on September 12th, 2007 @ 11:27 pm

    “Im willing to bet that while karachi’s politicians send money abroad, the lahore mass transit system will be up and running.” Well I hope that Lahore gets the MTP as planned. Its not a race that the two cities are trying to win.

    KMTP is a project of 80′s. I dont think that politicians were running the affairs of the state during that decade so there goes your bet of “Karachi’s politicians sending money abroad”.


  45. kaduna2003 (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 1:53 am

    “KMTP is a project of 80′s. I dont think that politicians were running the affairs of the state during that decade.”

    Au contraire, Mon ami.
    The destruction of karachi started in the 80s and continues to date. Before that, it was by far the best city in pakistan and far far ahead of lahore.

    And as long as the citizens of karachi are willing to be duped by their politicians and their antics, the money allocated to the city for development will keep disappearing to more “worthy” causes.

    It is possible to wake up some one who is sleeping. But it is not possible to wake up someone who has deliberately shut their eyes and thinks all is well while the city is taken over by the hounds of hell.


  46. ali (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 3:20 am

    part of the problem are the karachiites themselves. they are about themselves than about the city. if a handful of people fight (and i really mean FIGHT) for the rite they will get it, but no one bothers to. + pollution in karachi really needs to be controlled before it gets out of hand..and btw half the reason lahore feels like a “whiff of fresh air” is because it is made on forest land (CLEARED forest land).


  47. RockOnKarachi (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 9:12 am

    One thing is for sure…

    that ONLY KARACHI ROCKS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    ROCK ON KARACHI!


  48. Ali (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 9:26 am

    Well im a lahori, and came across ur post. I believe the problem lies not with the politicians or the government, we do have to realize the fact that these politicians are a part of our society, they are not from some other country they are actually pakistanis, probably if given a chance we might act in the same way they do, as abuse of power is somewhat in our blood.
    So what do we do? Have any of you ever tried to improve your sorroundings / environment, instead of criticizing, have any of you actually done something, i dont mean to say that you start building roads, but have ever tried to clean up your area?

    Secondly Karachi people are always bickering about this or that (iv been there many times) they do complain about the ethinicity of everyone around them. Sindhi trying to impose on the mohajir or vice versa. Why ??

    Lastly i believe every house hold in karachi believes that leaving pakistan is the best option for their kids, while majority i know in lahore beleives that working in pakistan is the best thing to do….. i can go on and on but anyways, my point being DO SOMETHING INSTEAD OF JUST WHINNING


  49. Obi Wan Kenobi (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 9:45 am

    Ali please read my earlier comment on this page.


  50. Adnan Siddiqi (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 12:31 pm


    while majority i know in lahore beleives that working in pakistan is the best thing to do,

    Yeah thats why you find lahories everywhere on earth. DUh!- Stop kidding please?


  51. Lahori (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 4:53 pm

    Most of the credit for Lahore’s progress goes to current Chief Minister Pervaiz Elahi.
    Those Karachies who say that Karachi suffers becoz of Lahore or Punjab must get past this old Rant and come up with a new one, Musharraf is supporting Karachi from the beginning while there has been no federal help in Lahore’s projects except Ring Road which is going on at a snail’s pace.


  52. Lahori (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 4:59 pm

    Most of the credit for Lahore’s progress goes to current Chief Minister Pervaiz Elahi.
    Those Karachies who say that Karachi suffers becoz of Lahore or Punjab must get past this old Rant and come up with a new one, Musharraf is supporting Karachi from the beginning while there has been no federal help in Lahore’s projects except Ring Road which is going on at a snail’s pace.


  53. Lahori (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 5:00 pm

    Most of the credit for Lahore’s progress goes to current Chief Minister Pervaiz Elahi.
    Those Karachies who say that Karachi suffers becoz of Lahore or Punjab must get past this old Rant and come up with a new one, Musharraf is supporting Karachi from the beginning while there has been no federal help in Lahore’s projects except Ring Road which is going on at a snail’s pace.


  54. RockOnKarachi (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 7:38 pm

    Once again….

    KARACHI ROCKS!
    ROCK ON KARACHI!


  55. imran (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 8:16 pm

    What the hell is this “your comments have been received and waiting for blog owner’s approval”” what happend to the freedom of speech on KMB>…now everybody’s comments will require approval..

    The above message I recieved when I tried to post comments for “The Essence Of Time In Light Of Karachi’s Weddings” Author Zainub Rizvi…


  56. SELF (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 8:37 pm

    “KARACHI ROCKS!
    ROCK ON KARACHI!”

    Can do with a little less rocking

    کراچی:بس پر فائرنگ، چھ ہلاک

    http://www.bbc.co.uk/urdu/pakistan/story/2007/09/070913_minibus_attack_rza.shtml


  57. RockOnKarachi (unregistered) on September 13th, 2007 @ 9:34 pm

    Karachi walas Rock simply because they are BRAVE enough to survive and live happily… Karachi is targeted by terrorists, racists and yet Karachi is alive and kicking!

    May God bless our Karachi! Ameen
    ROCK ON KARACHI & fight againts racists and terrorists!


  58. Karachi wala (unregistered) on September 14th, 2007 @ 9:17 pm

    First thing ……
    Karachi is contributing 67% of GDP.
    Secondly ……
    Even in terms of amount what karachi gets is less than lahore . And you can refer to any newspaper, any website. The reason given is, Since lahore is the capital of largest province of Pakistan so it should get more.
    Development budget approved for this yr reward punjab with 35 bn and sindh with only 5 bn. then how the hell even in terms of money karachi can get more than lahore.

    Now for those who have been criticizing on the politicians and on going projects of khi.
    When ever some builder tries to build a building over 30-35 floors PAF have a problem with that since they have bases all over khi. Victim projects have been Karachi finnacial tower, dolmen city (construction is halted due to paf notice), FPCCI tower, KPT tower. and many more.

    There is an institue named IAP(institue of architects Pakistan) based in lahore/islamabad. Whenever there is project proposed in khi. They are up with some funny objections.Victimized projects are Expressway over Sharah e faisal, and karachi mass transit Project.

    Now coming to those 2 islands. The objections were not at all posed by the politicians of karachi. But those F__kin sindhi politician, who even would not any knowledge about those island before the project was proposed.

    Now in general about the political scene in khi.
    From every corner of pakistan, a politician have to come to khi for their rally. Y not lahore.
    Y MMA chose khi for their rally when all of thier big names belong to lahore. Y ANP have to make their rallies in khi . Y imran khan always want to come to khi for their rallies y not lahore.

    Some one above claimed The most of the ppl in khi wants to go abroad and settle there. Go to overseas ministry, and see the stats, mostly ppl from upper and central punjab are settled abroad not from khi.

    Now if the Fedral govt is really conern about khi, y not there are more pubic sector unis in khi as compared to lahore, y there are more public hospitals in lahore as compared to karachi, y there are more it parks in lahore than karachi even no. of s/w houses in khi are more.

    I have been to lhr for 2 times. No doubt it is much greener than khi (but don’t forget it’s harder to make khi green as most of the land in khi is semi desert), much cleaner. But still the live is missing there. To be very true city blacks out after 12 mid night, empty roads almost no traffic.
    (one thing i need to mention here, lahoris don;t know how to drive, they have no traffic rules. i didn’t see any car stpping on red light :) )
    On the other hand khi is full of life. Even at 3 am you can see alots of car moving on roads. Rush at restaurants 10-15 km aways from khi (highways restaurants) can be seen at even 1-1:30 am.
    and I am fan of the traffic jams of karachi ….
    and that’s due to the number of cars not due to the breaking of traffic rules as i saw in lahore.
    I love to see the sharah-e-faisal jam from Regent to Nursary flyover. and this 2-3 KM is just because of number of cars . Which cannont be seen in anyother city of pakistan. And they need atleast 10 yrs to make such jams.

    With all the prob Karachi have, with all the extended support by federation to lahore and Islamabad, Karachi still leads and will lead for ever. Still the ppl in karachi are pround to be Pakistani. GA Karachi walay

    Since the 60 yrs of independence karachi sill contributes the most in GDP and % has increased with yrs instead of decreasing.

    Zindabad Pakistan
    Zindabad Karachi
    Zindabad Karachi Walay

    Love your Karachi


  59. SELF (unregistered) on September 14th, 2007 @ 10:28 pm

    “Karachi is contributing 67% of GDP”

    Can you substantiate your claim? What is it that Karachi has to contribute? The biggest money earners; cotton, wheat, rice, leather…how much of those are produced in Karachi? Or are you implying 65% of industry and/or services exist in Karachi?

    Let’s once and for all put this matter of 70 or 67% contribution to rest.


  60. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 14th, 2007 @ 11:15 pm

    Pakistan’s largest export: Textiles

    Where most of the cotton is grown? Answer: Punjab.

    Pakistan’s largest cash crop: Rice

    Where most of the paddy crop is sown? Answer: Punjab.

    We should not fool ourselves by blatantly bragging about ‘my city’ or ‘your city’, rather stop this BLAME GAME!!

    What this post was about, a genuine observation of Karachiite visitng Lahore after 8 years and look where this discussion was taken by these few people… B[


  61. RockOnKarachi (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 5:23 am

    The funniest part is that Lahoris compare there whole province with one city that is Karachi, I mean Karachi vs Lahore makes sense not Karachi vs Punjab!
    Well Lahoris prooved it, that Karachi ROCKS AND RULES!!!


  62. Obi Wan Kenobi (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 7:28 am

    Another thing is “Karachi” is name of thinking and living.


  63. SELF (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 10:42 am

    “The funniest part is that Lahoris compare there whole province with one city that is Karachi”

    Actually its the posters above comparing Karachi with the whole country….and implying that the rest of the country only contributes around 30-33% which to me sounds a little preposterous but I am waiting for some evidence before making judgment.


  64. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 12:40 pm

    ‘Self’ is right. My comment was also for the same people.


  65. ashaikh (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 3:58 pm

    “Karachi accounts for more than two-thirds of total revenue generated by the Central Board of Revenue each year. ”
    http://www.dailytimes.com.pk/default.asp?page=story_2-6-2004_pg5_10

    “Though only 4 out of 18 customs clearance houses are located in Karachi, 50 per cent of all the customs revenue is generated in Karachi.”
    http://www.pakistaneconomist.com/database1/cover/c2002-62.asp

    “During the year1995-96 the Central Board of Revenue (CBR) collected Rs568 billion or 89 per cent of total tax revenue of Federal and Provincial governments. Karachi’s share in total revenue stood at 71 per cent.”
    http://www.pakistaneconomist.com/database2/cover/c99-15.asp.

    “Half of the sales tax collected in Karachi was distributed in all parts of West Pakistan.” … “It was in 1974 NFC award that sales tax was completely federalized and the noises made in Karachi were ignored. It declared population as the only criterion for distribution of revenue.”
    http://www.dawn.com/2005/06/06/ebr15.htm


  66. From Karachi (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 11:11 pm

    Well done Ashaikh
    I would extend it a bit more

    well a post earlier says
    “Karachi is contributing 67% of GDP”, its not GDP but the revenue generated.
    Then Karachi contributes 50% of revenue generated by customs.
    Trading activities in Karachi is reflected by how the 2 stock exchanges of karachi are performing comparing to the rest in Pakistan.
    (For proof watch any pk news or business channel)
    If Karachi was not that great why almost all the major names in pk have their head offices in Karachi.
    (http://invest.surferzag.com/?p=6)
    Why still Government is not able to move state bank to Islamabad.

    With no offense against the rest of Pakistan at least they should realize the fact the Karachi is the BackBone of Pakistan Economy.

    I would like to add one more Source:
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Karachi


  67. Ali (unregistered) on September 15th, 2007 @ 11:48 pm

    Ham apas mai he lartai rahai gai .. stop blammin shoaib akhtar or shahid afridi or asif bhai .. galti govt. ke nahe hamari hai ..


  68. A for [pine]apple (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 2:30 am

    @Obi Wan Kenobi:

    Dear, Lahore is a name of not only thinking and living … Lahore is a kaifiyat :D


  69. karachi (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 5:37 am

    For SELF and Hasan Mubarak

    “Pakistan’s largest export: Textiles

    Where most of the cotton is grown? Answer: Punjab.

    Pakistan’s largest cash crop: Rice

    Where most of the paddy crop is sown? Answer: Punjab.”

    Which city has the most no. of textile mills : Karachi.
    (Infact all big names are in karachi)

    It’s the textile good that contributes towards the GDP not the cotton it self.

    Now my dear its the part of history that we are self sufficient in wheat and rice. Though condition of rice is not that dad as of wheat but it’s the matter of few yrs now. And the condition to wheat is quite visible yrly we import tons of wheat to fullfil our needs. :D

    It would be better if u compare lahore and sailkot
    for industry and GDP b/c karachi is far far far far ahead of any other city in Pakistan.


  70. Hasan Mubarak (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 3:45 pm

    My dear friends, we are not here comparing. It was just a realization that one city cannot exist without the rest of the country. Karachi IS the largest and one of the most important cities in Pakistan. Yes, it is, we don’t deny it. But it cannot be so without the rest of the country…

    Plus, I’ve never been defiant of Karachi’s economic importance, rather, I condemn this blame game of accusing Lahore and Punjab of all Karachi’s miseries.

    That’s the point. Buss, aur kuch nahin! :)


  71. Obi Wan Kenobi (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 6:57 pm

    70% Army Punjabies, 70% CSS jobs Punjabies. Go to any govt office in Khi and you will find punjabi officers. One of my friend was selected in PAF GDP program and he left it in middle because he was accused so many times of being “Nazuk” Urdu Speaking Muhajir(in Mid 90s). No Sindhi or Muhajir wants to trust in Punjab, See an example of Kala Bagh dam. These were the punjabies who broke the country in 1971. See any history book, the banglas always accussed Punjabies.

    I am not racist nor have any prejudice against any one but Punjab should accept that Karachi feeds them.


  72. Karachi (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 9:47 pm

    For:
    Obi Wan Kenobi
    “Punjab should accept that Karachi feeds them” HAHAHA quite true..
    I am still unable to find any sindhi or urdu speaker in khi police.. I can see only pubjabisss …… this is an interesting fact ….

    One more interesting thing about this conversation it started with some observable differences between kh and lahore then it became karachi vs lahore and now it’s karachi vs Punjab.

    This too shows Lahore is small enough to be compared with karachi. ;)

    Now getting to some serious issues…..
    This blog is accessible thru out the world. This is quite shamefull that we instead of potraying great Pakistan are fighting against each other (ek dosray ki pole khol rahay hain). I have never seen a city comparision blog progressing in this way wheter it is newyork vs chicago , mumbai vs banglore vs dehli or some thing else.

    Karachi has its own importance and lahore has it’s own. The fact Karachi progressed with such a pace was the port and memon and parsi community and initial educated worker force that migrated from india. This really help making karachi the economic and finnancial capital of Pakistan. And this status cannot be challenged. And should be accepted open heartedly.
    Again the importance of lahore lies in its history and IT challenge it has took up in modern days.

    Instead of rivalry that’s harmful for the country lets make this rivalry constructive. This would be better for our future and for the prosperity of our country.


  73. SELF (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:21 pm

    I could not find any like for like reliable figures for Karachi vs. country’s GDP but here is what I got;

    According to http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/richest-cities-2005.html Karachi had a GDP of $55billion in 2005. According to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Economy_of_Pakistan, Pakistan’s total estimated GDP is $475.5 billion in 2007. A rough guess as to how much it was in 2005 (at half of 2007) would be $237.75. That makes Karachi’s GDP at 23% of country’s. I know Pakistan’s GDP figure is adjusted for PPP i.e. the Gross Domestic Product (GDP) is calculated on a purchasing power parity, which adjusts the actual GDP per capita based on the costs of living in that country or city. I don’t know if Karachi’s GDP figure is adjusted for PPP making it a like for like comparison. If anyone has better figures please fee free to share.

    So taking Karachi’s GDP to 23% for now, since we are comparing Karachi with the rest of the country, let’s take out everything that Karachi gets from rest of Pakistan (cotton, leather, food, gas, oil, salt and even water) and recalculate the GDP (for a fairer comparison), which to my mind would be close to 0%.

    Those who claim that Karachi is feeding Pakistan, please feel free to not take what country gives them and see how long they can survive.

    I am not going to debate on how Karachi was a city well before any of the…ahem..guests…came in. I have highest respect for struggle for Pakistan and for those who suffered immensely as a result so no going there for me. I would however make some passing references to some facts; Lahore was *the best* (yeah check the history) in combined indo-pak, being the capital of the richest province. After partition, the capital of the nation should have been somewhere in Punjab being the majority province such as in Rawalpindi which would have taken the investment there. The national language of the country should have been Punjabi instead of Urdu which makes the majority of population learn another language while a minority gets away with without even learning the language of the majority (and seems somewhat proud of it as well), indeed a unique case in the history of nations. In most countries majorities will not even allow official recognition to minority languages/dialects let alone sacrifice their own language. Cotton is produced in Punjab, why was first textile mill set up in Karachi? …and many other points like this….but enough for now.


  74. SELF (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:35 pm

    We have an Urdu speaking President, Chief of Army Staff, Prime Minister, Governor Sindh, City Nazam and so on…

    First of all how come all these guys got there, if there is so much prejudice? Secondly we all know the mess the country and Karachi is in…

    In this country everyone got a chance to ruin the country and Karachi.. including the urdu speaking…so no complains there please.


  75. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:40 pm

    @ Self
    brother most of these points backfire at you dude!
    If you say Karachi’s GDP is 25 % of Pakistan !

    Then Why does Karachi give’s about 70% of Taxes too???
    What does that corresponds to???? 25% GDP is generating 70% tax!!
    “Lahore was *the best* (yeah check the history) in combined indo-pak, being the capital of the richest province. ”
    “After partition, the capital of the nation should have been somewhere in Punjab being the majority province such as in Rawalpindi which would have taken the investment there.”
    Ok ! Why was Punjabi Bureaucracy afraid of moving Capital to Dhaka?? When Bengal had more that 50% of Population! and something more! Before 1971 Everyone in Bureaucracy opposed division of Govt on sole basis of population, While just after 1971 Punjabis demanded that the division of Govt funds should be on the basis of Population Factor only!!
    As far as uoy richest province is concerned ! I dont know from where you get ur statistics ! A/c to Oxfords Pakistan Encyclopedia Dated 1994 (I have Hard Copy!) Sind was the most Urbanized province of Pakistan!

    I also can go on and on ! start start craping like you buddy!

    And when you say that U should have adopted Punjabi as national Language, just cause you are in Majority ! Why wasn’t Bengali Allowed to be the National Language when they were in Majority !!!

    Learn the history ! and then start your Crap about the Issue!


  76. SELF (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:40 pm

    “This too shows Lahore is small enough to be compared with karachi. ;)”

    According to http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/richest-cities-2005.html Lahore’s GDP is slightly above half of Karachi’s ($55b Karachi vs. $28b Lahore) this goes inline with the fact that Lahore has roughly half the population of Karachi. ;) ;)


  77. SELF (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:44 pm

    “This too shows Lahore is small enough to be compared with karachi. ;)”

    According to http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/richest-cities-2005.html Lahore’s GDP is slightly above half of Karachi’s ($55b Karachi vs. $28b Lahore) this goes inline with the fact that Lahore has roughly half the population of Karachi. ;) ;)


  78. SELF (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:44 pm

    “This too shows Lahore is small enough to be compared with karachi. ;)”

    According to http://www.citymayors.com/statistics/richest-cities-2005.html Lahore’s GDP is slightly above half of Karachi’s ($55b Karachi vs. $28b Lahore) this goes inline with the fact that Lahore has roughly half the population of Karachi. ;) ;)


  79. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:46 pm

    @ Self
    brother most of these points backfire at you dude!
    If you say Karachi’s GDP is 25 % of Pakistan !

    Then Why does Karachi give’s about 70% of Taxes too???
    What does that corresponds to???? 25% GDP is generating 70% tax!!
    “Lahore was *the best* (yeah check the history) in combined indo-pak, being the capital of the richest province. ”
    “After partition, the capital of the nation should have been somewhere in Punjab being the majority province such as in Rawalpindi which would have taken the investment there.”
    Ok ! Why was Punjabi Bureaucracy afraid of moving Capital to Dhaka?? When Bengal had more that 50% of Population! and something more! Before 1971 Everyone in Bureaucracy opposed division of Govt on sole basis of population, While just after 1971 Punjabis demanded that the division of Govt funds should be on the basis of Population Factor only!!
    As far as uoy richest province is concerned ! I dont know from where you get ur statistics ! A/c to Oxfords Pakistan Encyclopedia Dated 1994 (I have Hard Copy!) Sind was the most Urbanized province of Pakistan!

    I also can go on and on ! start start craping like you buddy!

    And when you say that U should have adopted Punjabi as national Language, just cause you are in Majority ! Why wasn’t Bengali Allowed to be the National Language when they were in Majority !!!

    Learn the history ! and then start your Crap about the Issue!


  80. Syed Johny (unregistered) on September 16th, 2007 @ 11:48 pm

    Brother ! even if Lahores GDP is half !!
    but why dont the Lahoris Pay taxes????



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