Decision to register Karachiites
Yesterday our President Mr. Asif Ali Zardari chaired a high level meeting to decide that Karachi’s local administration should start registering all people coming to Karachi, as well as tenants of the city, at police stations and adopt better and modern methods for making the city more secure. The directive is an effort to enhance the security of Karachi.
While today Governor Sindh Ishrat ul Ibad was actually more direct and mentioned that this effort is to control the influx of immigrants specially coming from the NWFP and FATA areas. Some how this new decision seems to have been to appease the MQM lobby in its recent surge to de-Talibanize Pathanization Karachi
Loading …
I support, this if done in good spirit. Karachi has long suffered un-controlled influx of refugees of all denominations, back in the seventies it was the fight against the Russians and millions of Afghans flocked not only to this city but also Quetta and Peshawar, whose old residents saw there cities go down the drain and they couldnt do anything to save it. overnight, business were overrun, transport systems taken over and drug cartels reigned supreme. No where in recent history, a country has been taken over by refugees like we saw happening in front of our own eyes. Take a look at Iran a similar number of Afghan refugees went there too, see how they regulated them at the same time administrering humanitarian aid.
The recent influx is from tribal areas of mostly affected families by the conflict raging there, there are few thing to keep in mind:
1/ Though Karachi will continue to take the bulk of the burden, but this time major cities of Punjab should also do their share.
2/ As it is well known that there is a movement name Tehreek-e-Taalibaan-e-Pakistan, which has admitted to using extremely violent means to propagate their philosophy. For them this influx is a golden opportunity to establish a foot hold in Karachi. Already there have been arrests of Baitullah Mahsood’s brother from this city. This is no joke. They have lot of Arab money to spread around.
3/ So if you are refugee, there is no harm in registering you. So that the govt has all the stats to plan help and assist in repatriation when things return to normal. This is standard practice all around the world.
What I fear is that this measure is specfically targetting Pathans and it may just push us closer to an all out war between Pathan and Muhajir - a repeat of the battles that MQM fought in the 80’s
The question is if this is implemented in the right spirit. for now its got a vested interest targetting a specific population based on ethnicity.
The demography bomb is bigger then the nuclear one and should be kept in check. It’s about time and a good step to curb THEM….Pashtuns and Pujabis.
Congratulations Zardari, Congratulation Irshat ul Ibad Bhai, Congratulations People of Karachi & Sindh…
It’s a good initiative & should have been taken long ago………but as always, its never too late. ….
….Now the SHO of Sohrab Goath (& areas like that) would have his (3rd or may be 4th) wife & several more children once this becomes a law…..
yes or this is a tool for him to even out the income of the area.
Well first off, I think this is a pretty serious situation, no country in the world has these sort of conditions on their own citizens to move around in their own country. Have you ever heard that the US Government has restricted the movement of the highly white supremacist Ku Klux Klan (KKK) in the USA? The answer is a simple NO, and if anyone is unaware of this group do search it on the internet, Talibans don’t even stand a chance when it comes to them in brutality, etc.
Hypothetically speaking, if I was transferred to Peshawar/Quetta for a job assignment, and I was asked by the provisional government of NWFP/ Balochistan to get myself registered because of fear of Secularization!
Think of this as a step to further destabilize the already deteriorating polico-economic condition of our motherland
This Zardari is one dumb Wadera. He wants to register all those Pakitsanis who wíll come to this filthy city from other areas of Pakistan whereas at the same time millions of Bangladeshis and Inidan Muslims are living illegally in the slums of Karachi and many have already acquired NICs and even Passports, and now instead of deporting those aliens he wants to lift visa restrictions imposed on Indians.
I will only say that this registration thing will further divide the country along ethnic lines and accelerate the process on disintegration of this fake country.
human01:It’s a good initiative & should have been taken long ago
yes, youre right, this step should have take lone time ago, in 1947 I would say.
human01:It’s a good initiative & should have been taken long ago
yes, you’re right, this step should have been taken many decades ago, in 1947 I would say.
i think registration wont solve the problem and its not a solution. why dont we try to dig out the root cause? even registratin is not going to solve the problem. and if registration is the solution the solution should be implemented al over the country on all places.
btw what we are goig to do after registration?
_______________________
http://www.dufferistAN.COM
1st step towards Independent Karachi. Now everyone entering will be registered.
Don’t the people living in tribal areas belong to Pakistan ?? And isn’t Karachi a part of Pakistan ?? Who has the right to stop people living in a country to move freely in it ??
Instead of registering n discriminating against them and causing a HUGE racial war in Karachi, the Govt n agencies should focus on the issues which is causing these people to migrate. Because they aren’t coming here for fun, there’s houses were bombed and they have no place to live.
Just imagine if your house was bombed and you had no place to live, and to add to it, people in other cities DON’T allow you to come there. Where would you go then ??
I guess doctor said it all.. Indian make Pakistani travelers register at Indian police stations during their stay in India. Now either MQM led govt here is following the footsteps of Indians and making Pakistanis register at police stations or Altaf got some other more sinister plans up his sleeves.. By registration If their intention is to keep a check on rising crimes and terror activities here in Karachi then what do they plan to do with MQM goon and terrorist who are operating under the patronage of MQM’s terrorist headquarter NineZero ?
MQM UC nazim, 15 MQM men arrested for ‘involvement’ in double murder, riots
http://tinyurl.com/mqmnazim15workerarrested
@TEETH MAESTRO Why do you want to make it a war issue? Thats going to another extreme.
There is term around the world called internally displaced refugees i.e people displaced by conflict in their own country. You grant them refugee status and they qualify for local and UN help. Now tell me whats the current number of people displaced by conflict in Waziristan? Do you have any reliable figures? Where these people have gone? who is taking care of them? Is there any aid going there way? How will you plan their future? How will you keep track of their movement and activities?
Ofcourse, like the govt of Punjab which is diverting truck loads here and there, nobody is restricting their movement in any other province. However, if you were an earthquake victim you registered some where, listed your losses and qualified for assisstance. In the prevalent circumstances when there is also a serious security issue, I think registration of refugees is essential.
Furthermore, federal and all the provincial govt should meet and devise an strategy to share the load and provide assisstance to these displaced souls in a coordinated way. Right now the only strategy that I am seeing is, "Send them all to Karachi".
For those who are ranting here is mine:
The tribal areas never called themselves Pakistani’s. They were always proud "Azad Afghan Qabail". Their territory was a no go area even for Pathans from settled areas, unless they knew somebody. Pakistan laws did not applied there. It was a place where only criminal Pakistanis and Arab terrorists got refuge. I was ok with that too, but lately a section of Tribal population wants to force us to live the way they think is appropriate and will go to any length to force their screwed up ideology upon us. This is a serious situation which cannot be taken lightly, but should be dealt with keeping the sufferring of the innocents who have been caught in the middle. There are not only victims caught between the security forces and Mahsood’s but there are also whole Shia Tribes that have been given marching orders by their Talibaan brothers.
@DUFFER registration is never done for solving the problem, it only helps to mange the affected. The solution is always political, millitary or economic or a combination of these.
TEETH MAESTRO said, "….- a repeat of the battles that MQM fought in the 80’s"
To make a correction the worst battles fought between the ethnic Pashtun’s and Mohajirs were well before the existence of MQM. The most notorious happened in 1985. The Bushra Zaidi riots were spontaneous and there was no existence of MQM. The Qasbah & Aligarh were not ethnic riots, but were day light massacres conducted by the (Afghan) Drug Mafia with due assisstance from the then administration.
Better get your facts right man!, these communities also clashed in the 60’s, during Ayub Khan’s reign. However since the coming of age of Muttahida, despite the events of May 12 and December 7, there have not been all out riots, no extended curfews and the lines of communications are always seem to be open between the community leaders.
Totally agree with Kami, if done with the right intentions & proper way, the whole process would help plan, allocate & organize the whole situation in a controlled & manageable manner. What we have learned from past is that the so called temporary displacements are never temporary…..100’s of slums (like Sohrab Goath & etc) was occupied by the Afghan refugees in late 70’s & 80’s & you can see, they are still here…. …..purely from management point of view…how would you plan for transportation, energy (electricity & gas) or any other public services if you don’t have the right statistics of the area…non the less an ongoing influx of 1000’s of people every day.
@ odin…..if this was done in 1974…….you still be shitting in caves (or in ur fields) & using stones & bushes to wipe ur a$$……so be thankful dude that u got some civilized people who taught u, how to be a civilized human……
@human01
Odin said it should have been done in 1947 not 1974. When the MUHAJIR’s were coming from India n started living in Karachi as REFUGEES. Wat would u have said if registration would have been started at THAT time ?? Would you have liked it ??
I meant 1947….mi mistake….
@nizro to correct you - In 1947 despite unprecedented mayhem, refugees were registered one way or the other, both sides of the border and claims were settled. Again I would stress, get your facts right before you make an statement.
That’s the point here….registration is not intended to do any harm…its just for check n balance….you have to know what’s going on….you can’t budget or plan any thing if there is no control over population….we are talking about 1000’s of influx in a city with limited resources….now you tell me, the better way to cope up with issue….other then planned even distribution of these people in other areas like Lahore, Pindi, Peshawar etc…..
if the registration is done with good intentions in mind (which i doubt) then its a good thing but if not then they can be a deadly weapon.
I think each Pakistany should take a part in registration and this kind of registration should be all over in the Pakistan, not only who are coming to Karachi also who already living in Karachi.
Last few words from me, I am Pakistany and can live or go any where.
TC
Well sinister intentions are quite obvious.. No good is intended for those the refugees , neither are they expecting any kind of assistance nor have they asked for any kind of assistance,they have been here since so many days and no assistance as such have been provided to them so far, basically this step isn’t intended for refugee management. During Ramzan Rehman Malik had announced a ceasefire and had asked people to return , many people wanted to go back but the ceasefire ended just a day after its announcement coz Americans didn’t approved ceasefire and used drones to stir up violence again.
During operation by Naeerullah baber many MQM goons ran away and took refugee in Mazars of interior sindh while many crossed over into FATA and took refuge there. Absconding criminal Altaf took refuge in UK..
@ odin…..if this was done in 1974…….you still be shitting in caves (or in ur fields) & using stones & bushes to wipe ur a$$……so be thankful dude that u got some civilized people who taught u, how to be a civilized human……
Before calling others uncivlized you need to learn to talk like a civlized man…is enough water available in the stinky lalookhet to wash your boney macaca ass you filthy bihari?
Stop fighting everyone. Lets just all pray that all goes well n nothing bad happens. Atleast thats wat we can do.
Bravo people, keep up the good work. Show everyone how n wat we are. And how we talk with each other. Keep it up.
@ nizro,
I like it CALM & PEACE, we all do, we all must and have to understand whatever the THIRD PARTY wants its now hapening….
STAY TOGETHER
@ Teeth
The worst Ethnic riots between Mohajirs and Pukhtoons occured in 1965 when Mohajirs supported and voted Fatima Jinnah against Ayub Khan, but how would you know that ?
You don’t belong from karachi you are here just like the people coming from NWFP i guess you should go and register yourself in Police Station.
One more thing, The Topic is also wrong.
Karachiites are people living here and burried here, and the people coming to karachi never accept karachi as their Mulak.
So they can’t be Karachiites.
@ KMB
As the KMB have given the verdict in favor of registration of people coming to karachi from up countries the topic should be changed from Decision to register Karachiites to Decision to Register Aliens coming to karachi from Up country.
@ Teeth
One more thing
You mention decision seems to have been to appease the MQM lobby in its recent surge to de-Talibanize Pathanization Karachi
How could we allow this to be happen in Karachi ??
Any Urdu speaking person wants this in karachi ??
Hello KMB ????
Anyone?
Karachiites are people living here and burried here, and the people coming to karachi never accept karachi as their Mulak
Wrong! Everybody who is living in this city bleongs to this city (apart from those Bangladeshis, Burmese and Indians who are living illegaly here)are and those who are coming to Karachi from NWFP or other areas of Pakistan have every right to settle down in this city and they don’t have to prove shit to anybody whether they consider Karachi as their "mulak" or not
Admin, sorry for the multiple identical posts, please delete the first one.
sabih on November 23rd, 2008 @ 12:33 pm
Well first off, I think this is a pretty serious situation, no country in the world has these sort of conditions on their own citizens to move around in their own country.
————————————————————-
That’s not true. In China, you have GOT to register before you move to Hong Kong and it’s a must to leave a couple of family memebers back in the mainland China. What it means is that you can not go to Hong Kong along with your whole family. Imagine what would happen to HK if half the china moved there just for better opportunities. I highly welcome this move. Karachi has become a mess lately and we need to keep track of people here. This city feeds the rest of the Pakistan and you have got to keep it safe, secure and terrorist-free.
I do not think people without Karachi’s domicile should be allowed to vote in Karachi unless there father or grand father got a Karachi domicile….
Zeeshan is right about the registration. I do not know how many of you guys been to China and have an interest in Chinese History (I had been there thrice) and lived in Hong Kong (during my childhood)….
There was a similar conflict between Li’s - the residents of Beijing and Hainan region and Han’s the farmer migrants. In order to avoid inevitable disaster’s they started registering Han’s which created peace.
There has been a registration process of migrants in Czech Republic, Slovakia, Bosnia, Poland and different European Nations….I know the problem still exists in Greek Cyrus and Turkey between Armenians, Greeks, Kurdish and Turks. Then there was and still is a problem between the German Speaking population in Belgian in East (correct me if I am wrong?) and The French….similar process is there in place in New Zealand and Lebanon to check the demography bomb.
@DOCTOR this is an age old strategy i.e. once you have lost an argument raise another one. But since you have raised it, I’ll be more specific. but will have to stray off topic. The Haqiqi Guys were the guests of Nawaz Sharif and were provided accommodations by him. Some of them may have been transferred to FATA, trained and brought back on military vehicles by the then agencies to take over Karachi. But that strategy did not materialize, because they were unable to win over the people.
Most of the MQM guys made their way to Baluchistan and thanks to their Balloach friends via launches to Dubai. Others went to London and US. Despite all this, what I see today is Mttahida, the only political party truly serving the people, whereas, the big two are nothing but a collection of black mailing MNA’s with corrupt leaders, Jamaat-e-Islami is lost in Jihaad some place and ANP may have won a victory, but are clueless about what to do now. Muttahida though still regimented has by far the most enterprising and hard working young leadership with a desire to build and move forward, hence, they still enjoy the support of their electorate.
Coming back to refugees, its not a question whether they want assistance or not, registration is necessary, because eventually they will use the cities resources, they will not pay any taxes, they will encroach upon private / public land, they will change the demography and there will be a question mark on their voting rights. For me this is not a Pashtun, Mohajir or Punjabi issue. This is an unfortunate occurrence and the whole nation should play its part to deal with it.
In the recent and not so recent past the people of this city have shown to the world that they can selflessly offer more than a helping hand to the fellow countrymen in need, but what is found lacking is reciprocity.
I have not gone through the comments but this is very stupid thing to do and it is just the start of end . Today, you need registration and tomorrow you will need visa.
finally someone acted bold and stoodup for Karachi. Thank you Zardari, though I don’t like you as person, but you surely have made some Bold tough decisions. Thank you again
When you have to choose between multiple kameenaas, such as Zardari vs Nawaz vs Qazi vs Fazlu, Zardari is a better choice for Karachiites. He has a vested interest in Karachi. Also, since the lafangee woman died, I don’t hate Zardari anymore. My hatred for lafangee was based on her family name. Three generations of assholes: Sir Shah Navaz, Zulfiqar, Lafangee. Khas-kum-jahan-Pak.
Allama Balma was very depressed after the elections. Phir vohee kameenay aa gaye? That was my reaction. But, then I said ab Balma kay alaavaah koee aur farishtah tou aanay say rahaa Pakistan may, so I said lets see who is best for my immediate environment, and Zardari won.
Also, I thought I rather have open sharaabi-kabaabi than chhoopay roostam like Navaz: Ooper say ameer-ul-momeeneen banay huay hai’n, under say Tahira Syed aur Rekhaa ko line dae rahai hai’n! Plus, Navaz Sharif has no interest in keeping Karachi safe.
I simply dont understand whats the point of registering and issuing IDs to non-karachites. un sub logoon ko tou passport per visa lay ker karachi ana chahiye!!!!
Altaf a friggin` criminal on the run having blood of thousands of Karachiites on his hand have been staying permanently in a foreign land and haven’t returned ever since. Whereas in this case these Pakistani families have fled and left their homes coz their homes are being bombed(80 % of them would return minute things calm down) . They are not criminals on the run like absconding Altaf and they don’t need MQM’s permission or stamp of approval to stay here . If Altaf can permanently stay in a foreign land as long as he likes then definitely these Pakistanis can stay IN PAKISTAN anywhere and as long as they like.
kaami
When i talked about MQM’s criminals taking refugee in tribal areas during Naseerullah Baber’s operation,i was specifically talking about MQM Altaf(i won’t talk about who trained them and where)but many of them saved their skin by hiding in Mazars of interior sindh while many as you mentioned ran away to dubai,UK,USA,South Africa etc.
Sardar Attaullah Mengal in a tv interview while commenting on Altaf’s threat to quit Musharraf’s government if Balochistan operation didn’t ended, said that I am aware that Altaf is famous for shedding crocodile’s tears and thats exactly what he is doing now on balochistan issue,I don’t take him seriously."
So some launch smugglers and human traffickers might surely be MQM’s friends as MQM is a criminal gang so obviously it must have links with other criminals too but Balochis as friends hmm well i have doubts about that.
Areas infested with MQM’s unit and Sector goons have recently witnessed a massive surge in enchroament of public parks and playgrounds. DOZENS of parks and large chunks of lands have been encroached and plots have been demarcated and handed over to MQM goons. Interesting thing is that encroachment of green areas are rampant in areas infested with MQM’s unit offices( in more than 40 parks in North Nazimabad Town alone, Muttahida Qaumi Movement’s sector and unit offices have been constructed )
Jaisy Awam waisay hakim !!
Awam Haram kam ker rehe hay tu Hakim kia keray ga ?
Awam Sharab pe rehe hay tu Hakim kion nahi ?
Awam Dakkay mar rehe hay tu Hakim kion nahi ?
*Farad
*Rishwet
*Soode
*Zana
*Gana Nachna
*Girls & boys are FREE
*Nasha
*Haram Khana
My friend we have lost the TRACK !! Earthquakes are trying to remind us but eeemm unfortunatley we are in deep sleep and will wakeup on the judgement day.
AND those who gave example of Hong Kong just proved that they’re nothing but half brained MQMized clowns. Here we are talking about a PAKISTANI CITY Karachi and PAKISTANI CITIZENS, NOT altaf’s independent jinnahpur .
@ Doctor,
Relax man, no one is going any where…. do not blame on them they are also our brothers weather they are MQM or PPP or what so ever we all are one…..
Peace
@ Doctor
You and people with your sort of mentality lost here again.
See 70% is favoring the registration of pathans coming to karachi.
Awaz e Khulq ko Naqqara e Khuda Samjho
wkhang,
Afer reading your list of attributes, I feel like asking:
"Janaab, aap Afghanistan kab tashreef lay jaa rahay hai’n?"
@DOCTOR again you loose your cool and lose the argument, branching out in all directions might be a carefully formulated defaming strategy but it does not serve the purpose. As for your MQM phobia try getting 16 shots, it might cure you.
You made some very nasty statements, let me remind you that whole of Pakistan is one big criminal operation. Where the heads of the two biggest political parties are no more than ordinary thieves, the rest of them are murderers, smugglers, fanatics, and terrorists. Sadly, those who are idealistic, are directly or indirectly responsible for the deaths of thousands. If you want to look at the picture that way then a substantial number of Balloach sardars are car thiefs, the Azad Areas of FATA (not Pakistan) are crime dens, Jamaat-e-Islami is nothing but fitna instigators / destabilizer’s, Muslim League is nothing but a band of opportunists, PPP is nothing more than hullar baazi and Imran Khan is just a confused, disappearing and under achieving political monkey. And despite all this I must say again,“Muttahida is the only party that is serving the people.” and for that they don’t need your certificate. HAHAHA
As for the refugee issue, people have made valid and sane arguments on this forum, from both side of the spectrum, and I think enough has been said for a neutral observer to make up his mind one way or the other.
@ Balma,
Meray Bahi,
aap kay nam say legta hay KAY ap Hindi Movies Bohet dekhtay han.
(NO OFFENCE). Or app nay hawa may teer chalanay ke achi koshish ke hay.
No Further Conversation with you.
@ All,
Just want to express more thoughts here, if we go back ten years hhhmm do we have this kind of conversations or issues ? If the answer is, no, then my question is again, why ?
http://me-swa.blogspot.com/
http://pakteve.blogspot.com/
@ Kami,
As per you:
"You made some very nasty statements, let me remind you that whole of Pakistan is one big criminal operation"
Kami Dear Bro,
Please watch your mouth man while you are expressing your feelings you NEVER FORGET THAT YOU ARE ALSO A PAKISTANY !!!!!
Thank you and have a nice night without fear.
@ Doctor
the whole of karachi is enchroched by filthy pathans and punjabies , the surroundings of this city even Nadi and Nallahs have been enchroched but you never raised your eye brow on it !
@ KMB
You people know for yourselves how Karachi property have been enchroched even the Hill tops in North Nazimabad are enchroched and a visit to North Nazimabad blk S,T,P,Q,R you people can find bunkers on the top of the hills, Just go to that areas see fo yourselves,
The reason for doing anti MQM propaganda is just to break the unity of urdu speaking people so that these anti mohajirs can hunt the mohajirs easily, But that can’t be happen.
All the Mohajirs are united and we will defend not only our areas but also the lives and our properties as well.
I request all of you to just go to library and read the newspapers(Dawn/Jang) from 12 Dec 1986 to 17 Dec 1986 you will find the similar Pukhtoon Action Committee now headed by Shahi Saed, read those papers see the pictures of innocent Mohajirs burnt to death or murdered in cold blood by these Pukhtoons just to avenge operation against Drug Mafia @ Sohrab Goth.
Go read them its an open request and also read the statement of shahi saed , He clearly wants to destroy Karachi.
jang.com.pk/jang/nov2008-daily/24-11-2008/mulkbharse/nat2.gif
Meray Bacho,
Ager issy terhan lertay rehay tu soon this map will become true, and the third power will win: http://www.theglitteringeye.com/images/petersmapafter.jpg
Kissy kay hath kuch nahi aye ga ….
wkhang behen,
hum nay zaraa see baat karee, tou buraa maan gayae?
Yes, if by Hindi you mean movies from Hind (India) yes I do watch Urdu movies from India every once in a while. I can also read/write devnagri script (which is probably what you meant by Hindi) a little bit.
You must have been brought up during Zia-ul-Haq time whn any word that was too desi in root was replaced by Arabic or Farsi word!
BALMA GEE,
I was right, I knew your kind of persons (my brother) grow where "subeh indian movie, rat indian songs" I hope you will not mind it because you are so use to this system that you cant come out of it.
I knew you can also write devnagri script and you may know other languages in Indai which are 347.
Balma GEE,
May nay kuch bura nahi mana Jany : ), Bahi app jo kuch kehtay ho seb sahi nahi hota.
TC
khaled90, the whole of karachi is enchroched by filthy pathans and punjabies ,
************
yaar khaled bhai what goes around comes around.The original inhabitants of this city were Balochis and Sindhis (most of those Sindhis were Hindus though) who were kicked out by the new comers from India, now the ‘filthy’ Pathans and Punjabs are coming in big numbers to Karachi, and they have every right to come here and nobody can ever stop them from coming, and filthier Mohajirs are whining like a raped whore. Khaled bhai instead of spreading hatred we should learn to live together like brothers, Pakistan is going through a very hard time and if Pakistan breaks up then we will all be losers.
wkhang on November 25th, 2008 @ 3:26 am
Meray Bacho,
Ager issy terhan lertay rehay tu soon this map will become true, and the third power will win: http://www.theglitteringeye.com/images/petersmapafter.jpg
Kissy kay hath kuch nahi aye ga ….
*************
exactly wkhang, we all will be losers. There are some people in Karachi who seriously think (I don’t need to tell you here who those people are, we all know them very well. We can not live with Hindus, we can not live wiht Sindhis and we cannot live with Pathans and Punjabis
is their motto) that Karachi will be far better of and can exist as a separate sovereign state if Pakistan disintegrates, some people are damn fool and myopic.
@ Odin
Karachi was a small town before partition, it was urdu speaking people who built this city, as far as old sindhis and balochis of this city are concern they are still living here the old sindhi goths and old city areas are still present in the city like Gadap, Lyari,Bin Qasim, Hawksbay etc and nobody kicked them out from karachi soo i guess your point is not only invalid but also bunch of lies.
as far as hatred is concern i am not spreading hatred, this forum is continuously spreading Hate against Urdu speaking people and its representative party MQM.
Don’t you see the hate propaganda against MQM and Urdu speaks all around?
Everyone has the right to come to karachi nor argument about that but i am talking about the encroached land and illegal constructions on the land of this city and the silence over it quite dubious,
the flats on super highway are all caputred by force by Pathans and nobody is even raising voice over it, from chappal to iqra apartments all the residents have been forced out from their property.
it should be a well planned conspiracy to convert the sindhi and urdu speaking population into minority and that is the reason of Asif Zardari orders to registered every one coming to karachi.
Pre-partition Karachi was a very well planned and developed city, actually it was the Islamabad of British India. It had some very good colleges and schools that are still considered the best in the city. The whole city was built and planned by the Britishsers and its real residents, Sindhis and Parsis, were very educated people. I don’t lie Khaled bhai, I aint a follower of quaide fassad. Mohajirs didn’t built this city from the scratch, actually for the slum dwellers of Patna and Delhi, Karachi was like a heaven on earth. Hindu Sindhis were in majority in Karachi who were kicked out by the newcomers and their property was taken over by the Mohajirs.
I know how many bhaichara exists between Sindhis and Mohajirs, a dumb Wadera has given a foolish statement and every follower of quaide fassad is jumping up and down in ecstasy.
How many Mohajirs are living on encroached land khaled bhai? You’re right the flats of Asif Square were taken over illegally by Afghans and Pakistani Pathans, but is hammam men to sab hi nangey hen sirf aik pe hi kion ungli uthatey ho khaled bhai.
There is no conspiracy against anybody, only if some people could take off their glasses of hatred and prejudice that they are wearing.
@khaled90 the whole of karachi is enchroched by filthy pathans and punjabies , the surroundings of this city even Nadi and Nallahs have been enchroched but you never raised your eye brow on it !
So u mean MQM is justified in encroaching the ameneties of one of the best planned localities of karachi because the previous governments/ people did that too?
In this blog for sure some Indians are writing !!!
odin Whatever you say, please don’t draw any parallels between the current scenario and the partition of India, because there are none. It was a tragedy that effected untold millions from Sindh to Bengal. On the other hand the situation in the north is caused by a localized mutiny against the state of Pakistan, resulting in innocent people being displaced. The region needs to be stabilized by both millitary and political means. The people affected and displaced by the conflict are the responsibility of the State of Pakistan (including all the four provinces), they need to provide assistance, keep track of, provided help and repatriated. The issue should be handled in such a way that it does not affect demography, stability and security of any particular region. That is all there is to it. Its not only the question of Karachi. Do you know how many original residents of Peshawar and Quetta had to leave their city, simply because it was Overrun by Afghans?
And please don’t make any broad statements like, “Some ppl in Karachi think this way or that way”. The fact is Muttahida the representative party of the people of this city believes in the Federation of Pakistan, contests election from the whole country has membership in the whole country and wants to reach out and work with other political forces to take this country forward. They know how to do it and are showing it to the rest of the world. If on other hand the “myopic” others backed by religious right keep on labelling them with names, refusing to accept their existence, and trying to isolate them, nothing good will come out of that approach.
@ Odin
my dear odin i think you are a child or don’t know about the history of this city.
U know Karachi was not even exits after Guru Mandir ?
all the development occurred after the partition and urdu speaking people developed this city.
No measure clashes occurred between urdu speaks and sindhis till 1973 nor any sindhi complaint against anything.
Pakhtoons urdu speaks tensions how ever exists from late 50’s and still present.
before the creation of MQM urdu speaks were always on the receiving end as urdu speaks traditionally don’t carry weapons but Pukhtoons did carry weapons as their tradition.
anywayz karachi is encroached by these pathans and punjabies and this is true if you don’t want to accept the truth what anyone can do ?
@ odin
As someone who has spend a lot of time investigating on partition and my subject is partition let me say that the Muslim Migrants from UP, Bihar, AP, CP, Mahrashtra, Gujrat, Most of Centreal and South India were upper & lower middle class & rich folks who migranted because they saw new opportunities in Muslim not Islamic Pakistan as compared to India. The pictures you see on television of donkey carts carrying children are of East Punjab Refugees who crossed borders on foot and train while most of the other migrants came via ferry (which costed Rs.220-250 one way via Bombay to Karachi) – our Bohra Community operated the the ferries and sorted the logistical problems. Partition was was rich not for the poors – equally the well-off Hindus and Sikhs left Pakistan leaving the poor back……
1. Gauhar Ayub`s state terrorism against Mohajirs resulting in many deaths
2. Peaceful and shameful surrender of Paki Army in East Pakistan with no provision for Mohajir “razakaars,“ who bore the brunt of cruel Bengali vengeance.
3. Sindhi riots instigated by Bhutto`s campaign to punish Mohajirs for NOT supporting him in 1970/1971.
4. Massacre of hundreds of Mohajirs, including children, at the hands of Pathan tribesmen in 1986 at Sohrab GoTh with no accountability, trials, investigation of murderers by Zia`s dictatorship.
5. Army actions against Mohajirs in Karachi and Hyderabad in early 90s.
6. Continued suffering of “stranded“ Mohajirs in Bangladesh at the hands of a shameless government`s refusal to repatriate them.
7.The quotas in Sindh that discriminate against urban dwellers in favor of rural ones are unique in that there is no such distinction in Punjab, NWFP, and Balochistan.
This Profiling seems to be reminiscent of LAPD’s plan to profile Muslims in the greater Los Angeles area which itself could have been compared to Hitler’s plan to profile Jews in Nazi Germany. Only a moron imbecile less than room temperature buffoon like Asif Ali Fucktard Zardari could have thought of that plan.
Mushuruf was much better leader. Unfortunately opportunistic thugs supported Zardari instead of him when they saw him going down.
@ barristerakc,
RELAX MAN, you are providing wrong information here.
Hope the swine Zardari gets to see his wife soon.
wkhang - what’s wrong about the information…? correct me, pls!
Difficult times – please understand although you are right about Zardari and Mushraff but do you know that half of the country is collapsing? On principle yes, profiling one ethnicity is wrong and generalization creates problems (and although that’s not going to happen) but a statement from the president is symbolic plus you have to understand that with people migrating from FATA to Sindh (where Punjab Govt. has refused to shelter them!!!!) are not just carrying diseases like polio etc…but are involved in serious crimes and terrorism related activities apart from enforcing a brand of religion not acceptable to us (being a Deobandi/Wahabi myself – I condemn enforcing religion)……and very dispassionately, they should be accommodated and why not ? and registering them is one way to keep a tab on them (our own brothers & sisters)….
Having said that, Pashtuns could be accommodated but the problem are Punjabis – a cancer which should be stopped and countered.
The hate for Punjabis is Alhumdullah One thing which unifies Pakistanis
Why are Fake Profiles made by RSS indian morons posting here?
wkhang behen,
Can you enlighten us which one of Vakeel’s points 1 though 9 is wrong?
I don’t know about how every one else feels, Gauhar Ayub has the distinction of organizing first ethnic riots in Pakistan. Even neem-hakeem-khatra-e-jaan will agree with me on this. Kyoon doctor bhayyaa kyaa khyaal hae?
And idiot wkhang, just because I wrote neem-hakeem…does not mean that I watch too many Indian movies. Kaha’n kahan’n say fuckers uTh kar aajaatay hai’n?
Hazrat Alama Balma,
Whang,this new kabul ke bulbul and the rest of the moderators of KMB represents the "mijaartee" of Pakistanis who have conveniently forgotten the racism meted out to the "new" Pakistanis from the "new" Indian territories by the "sons of soil". It’s the same old story and seems to rear it’s head every few years. Formation of MQM and assumption of the "mohajir" identity has now become the object of derision and scrutiny by the racist tormentors of the past. Prior to this, it was the legitimacy of the nationality (i.e. "quamiyat") of the "hindustanis" that was the constant target. Mohajir are damned if they do and damned if they don’t.
While people like Dr.Awab Alvi should spend their time and energies to abrogate racist "quota system" of Pakistan that was primarily insitituted to support the rural majority over urban minority of Karachi. It’s a racist practise that every justice loving Pakistani should rise up against. Unfortunately those protests are reserved for corrupt CJs and their political puppet masters
Kudos to the Mohajirs who have managed to thrive despite every road block erected in their path to progress and education by both rulers with ethnic agendas and ethnic groups.
When confronted with racists like TMs, Doctors, Whgang, Rockfeela and religiousists like Adnan, is it any wonder that Mohajirs want to band together under a common MQM banner. There must be something very real, very threatening, very monstrous, that unites people from UP, Bihar, MP, Gujarat, Maharashtra, Hyderabad, Tamil Nadu, Rajasthan, Mysore, and Delhi with each other against Punjabis, with whom most Urdu-speakers have much more in common in language, dress, and food.
While women in Punjab, NWFP, and Sind are raped, beaten, and mutilated; while illiteracy and ignorance are the main provincial languages; while feudalism is the primary economic policy: while Islam is being perverted to the point of 16 century Catholicism; and while poor nations like Bangladesh perform acts of charity for "stranded Pakis," these charlatans and hypocrites find it their duty to point out pimples on the faces of MQM youth. Is it any wonder that the Paki goose is getting goosed everywhere?
kid, i don’t know where your cerebral neuronal connections are firing these delusional thoughts from but most educated urdu speaking karachites vehemently oppose the MQM.
In the mean time enjoy the blasts at your place. Possibly a reaction to the Marriott hotel blasts by Indian controlled Tehrik-e-Taliban.
LOL …welcome to the reality….thanks for your sweeping statement…..
They keep away from Altap Pai’s jalsas but they vote for him and that what matters….!!!
@khalid90
You’re right Karachi was a small city at the time of partition, its population was almost half a million but it was a clean, rich and developed city,just like today’s Islamabad as I said in my previous post. Karachi had good schools and colleges, it had trams at the time of partition, its Port was competing with Bombay’s port and scores of Wesetern companies had their branches in Karachi and its residents Parsis, Bohris, Sindhis were very educated and business oriented people. Those Sindhi Hindus who were kicked out by the immigrants are still considered the most educated and richest community in India.
It is wrong to say that Mohajirs were always on the receiving end, before the creaton of MQM, almost all the members of JI in Karachi were
Mohajirs and they were armed to the teeth with the weapons. Most of them had joined MQM after its creation and MQM had indeed acquired its first weapons and terrorists from JI.
And why any kind of clashes should have happened between Sindhis and Mohajirs, those poor Sindhis were already reduced to an insignificant minority by the immigrants.
Yaar kahaled bhai, try to get rid of prejudice and hatred you are bearing in your heart against all the non Urdu speaker, it’s very unhealthy dude.
@odin now you are going to another extreme, implying that its all Mohajir’s fault and there contribution is none. Yes Pre-Partition Karachi was a well run small Parsi Town, forgive me it was not competing with Bombay in any way, in fact Bombay was the capital of Sindh.. So you can say Karachi was like a small peace full trading post, which no one had heard about. At that time what Pakistan was badly missing was a financial system, a Federal Reserve and our own banks. 1948 Central Bank of India was still operating in Pakistan and funds were being transferred like hell. At that time hindus joked about financial acumen of muslims and for this reason they precluded that Pakistan will not last a year. But that did not happen, Zahid Hussain founded the State Bank, there were no commerce colleges / training institutes so the newly hired “unpaid” bank employees turned to “Kabaria’s” found books and taught themselves subjects like Foreign Exchange and Branch Operations. And Pakistan survived and became viable and ironically its Banks became the most efficient in the whole continent. Thus, Karachi / Pakistan flourished.
Yes, Hindu Sindhi traders were quite affluent and were in import export business with Europe, particularly France. However, majority of Hindu Sindhi’s were in the money & commodities business and almost all the Sindhi Zamindar’s owed a lot of money to them. Out of the tragedy that was partition and the millions that were displaced, Hindu Sindhi’s were the most lucky ones, though they suffered quite a few attacks, but on the whole, they got safe passage, were able to transfer their wealth, their convoys were not slaughtered, unlike the refugees from, UP, East Punjab and Bengal, whose misery is unmatched in the history (on both sides of the border). So overnight after the departure of Hidu sindhi’s the local zamindar’s found themselves debt free and also helped themselves with huge chunks of hindu lands in their vicinity. My friend partition is not black white, some lost everything and some got fortune’s. Within the so called mohajir community, some got big houses against bogus claims, others did not even submit any claim. So please, don’t generalize, please leave it at that.
sindhi’s were never a insignificant minority, furthermore, the interests of both the communities did not clash, because they were not competing against each other, however there was disparity due to enormous wealth generated by the commercial success of Karachi. Mr. Z.A. Bhutto, exploited this for political gains, created rifts, nationalized businesses and instead of working to repeat the Karachi success story in other parts of the province, he destroyed what was created, diluted merit, introduced quota and created an atmosphere of confrontation. This might have suited his politics but the set back to the whole nation was atleast 25 years.
Again to correct you before MQM the major political force in Karachi was not JI, it was Moulan Noorani’s JUI. And though I agree, JI-Karachi was one of the first to have weapons courtesy, Afghan jihaad. It never fought for or pressed for the interests of this city. As we all know JI is a one big collection of brain washed religous ideologs, who have got there own agenda’s, to them interests of this country or the city are trivial and insignificant as compared to the screwed up greater cause.
The Majority of Karachites do not vote in the elections and out of many votes that are cast in, plenty of them are bogus.
btw, JI was always a political force in Karachi, not JUI. Its mostly composed of highly educated urban professionals unlike the maderssah educated JUI people.
kublaikhanzai , whatever bastard!
For those interested here is an interesting articcle on the History of Karachi
http://www.zimbio.com/World+Politics/articles/2129/History+Karachi+Heart+Pakistan+crossraods
@kublaikhanzai JI was always a political force in Karachi but second to JUI 0f Moulana Noorani. JUI-Noorani always got the most seats from this city. But now its insignificant, because an overwhelming majority votes for Muttahida, there are no two questions about that.
barristar: Lol, angry at the deccan mujahedeen. Injuns deserved what they got.
Kammi: We all know mostly the semi educated working class people vote in Karachi. The highly educated ones mostly refrain from voting.
@kublaikhanzai - So you mean highly educated ones are in the majority? If thats the case then Karachi will be unique in the whole world.
BTW all the majority in my family i.e. Doctors, Bankers and Ph.D’s did cast their vote. :-)
Kammi: How many percent votes were casted in Karachi in the last elections?
Guys you know what the problem is? Nobody in this country is taught history in an objective and impartial manner, whether it be pre / post partition or pre / post Islam. The doses we do get are highly doctored and flavoured to suit a certain taste. The text books are worthless and what we get from our parents comes spiced up with prejudice. That spice might be of race, language or religion. So the ordinary people of this country are an easy prey to the self righteous and corrupt politicians as well as religious leaders, who can then use them as cannon fodder.
@kaami
Every resident of Karachi, regardless of his ethnic background, did participate in the building of Karachi. This honour doesn’t go to only one particular ethnicity.
Is it true that quaede fasaad’s lundaas are threatening Pathan shopkeepers in Hyderi. Is every Pathan fruit seller a potential Taleban and terrorist now?
wake up mohajirs
now pathans after 27 dec 2007 again putting hands on mohajir women.
img143.imageshack.us/img143/3333/aj1cc8.jpg
img135.imageshack.us/img135/8759/aj2xh9.jpg
indians should wake up as well. Deccan mujahedeen are putting hands on hindu women there. Lol
Now Khaled you will also tell us what those pathans did to mohajir women, wont you? Are they beating Mohajir women like this londa of quaede fasaas?
http://tinyurl.com/5f2hyv
One things is for certain. If Pakistan is to survive then corrupt morons like Zardari and Nawaz be kicked out forever.
and untested people like Imran Khan be given a chance.
khaled bahi bata to do kia kia pathanon ne. 2 betuki images ka link chaap ke ghayab ho gaye ho. kia quaide fasaad ne abhi tak bataya nahin ke is dafa kia propaganda karna he?
Vakeel writes *****
There must be something very real, very threatening, very monstrous, that unites people from UP, Bihar, MP, Gujarat, Maharashtra, Hyderabad, Tamil Nadu, Rajasthan, Mysore, and Delhi with each other against Punjabis, with whom most Urdu-speakers have much more in common in language, dress, and food.
My response ***********
Yes, I find it interesting. As I have said it before, that ethnically and linguisticly speaking, Urdu speakers from UP and Panjabi speakers have more in common (I consider Urdu as +1 version of Panjabi) than between Urdu speakers from UP and Gujrati speaker from Gujrat. Actually, it goes long way. Even before partition, you can read Minto’s writings (in Urdu) against UP’s Urdu speaking bhayyaas!
On the other hand, I have heard of lots of Panjabi speakers voting for MQM, especially after the meaning of first M changed.
Also, I believe that many of MQM’s policies are wrong.
But, no one is perfrct!
Good Morning Everybody!
Ameer Izat Maaf Balma (balma sab ka kalma)
You are right (as you know already I am from Fatehpur Sikri, UP originally).
Interesting reading would be Sir Syed Ahmed Khan’s politics in late 1800’s and early 1905-1910 – SAK had always been a UP-Nationalist instead of an Indian Nationalist that’s why even mainstream political parties helped him. Although primarily he advocated to reserve special right’s given to the Muslims of UP after 1857 when UPites (especially the Muslims) were active against the British – again, Punjabi Army was used by British to crush the movement. If were not for Shaheed Bhagat Singh and the brave patriots of Jillian Walla Bagh, almost ALL Punjabis would be considered traitors to India as far as helping the British is concerned. During the 1857 “Ghadr,“ Punjabi forces helped to put down the united rebellion of Hindus and Muslims of UP, Bihar, Bengal, Delhi, Haryana, CP, and elsewhere.
Btw, We should always remember the role of Shah Wali Ullah, Ismail Shaheed
as educators too…I am in a process of writing an article about it.
Balma G,
During British Raj, unfortunately some pure Urdu speaking areas were transferred to United punjab and Urdu and Persian were made the official languages. This was a huge mistake and we the Muhajirs are bearing the brunt of these grave follies. Haryana being one which parted from East Punjab.
Punjabis and Mohajirs are very different people - just like TNT. Our cultures, our languages, our food, and even the way we talk and joke around differ in a polarized manner. We should respect each other, but be allowed to go our separate ways.
Mohajirs did not come to an already established country as many emigrated to US, Canada, UK, UAE, Australia, and elsewhere. Mohajirs arrived in Pakistan with all their talent, much of their capital, and proved Mr. Nehru wrong. Nehru had predicted that Pakistan could not function as a state and would be begging to return to India. He was right in that Pakistan did not have the educated talent necessary to run a modern state. Mohajirs provided that workforce, that level of education, and that expertise that they brought with them from New Delhi, Lucknow, Bombay, Bhopal, Hyderabad, Agra, AligaRh, Calcutta, Rampur, Meerut, and yes, Jaipur.
I never claimed MQM as “pak” and “pawatir”. Our real bone of contention is why be MQM-phobic? Centric? When you have greater evil (assuming that everyone is evil) in Pakistan.
(PS. I could email you some of my articles published on MQM, Mohajirs, Partition, Identity…email:akchishti@hotmail.com)
@kublaikhanzai - so now you come out, I am afraid that you are expecting too much from Imran Khan, that disappearing monkey, and Alqaeda sympathiser will be no where to be seen at the time of crises (as he has proven on a number of occasions) He is a talk show politician and that’s all.
@odin, of course but you so conveniently set aside the achievements of one community, that I had to set the record straight. 1947 was a whole different ball game, its a story of a motivated people, who shrugged off an enormous tragedy and set about building a country and proving a point. Not like now, when to be righteous you have to be radical and capable of blowing things up.
As for Hyderi you tell me? go out there and ask people, get a first hand account and avoid succumbing to the Jamatee propaganda machine.
@Barrister Sahib I beg to differ. As far as Sir Syed Ahmed Khan is concerned I believe he was more concerned about the well being of the Shurafaa class rather then ordinary Muslim of UP.
As long as Persian was the official language, Muslim beuraucracy held sway but after the introduction of english things changed and Sir Syed wanted the Muslim Educated Class to adapt and maintain their share in the Govt services. He was not worried about mazdoor, tarkhaan, sabzee faroosh or simply the uneducated. They were not considered Shurafaa.
However, this should not take away any credit for his contribution towards enlightment of Muslims and development of institutions.
Ghadr was a lost cause and it was dead b4 it began, it needed the last Mughal Emporer to lead and take charge, but nor he and neither anyone in his family had the guts, will, money or strength to take on this task. This is not unusual for a decaying dynasty.
Kami Sahib – you are mostly correct about Sir Syed’s selective struggle for the Shurfa Class of UP - however, Sir Syed Ahmed Khan started the “Aligarh Movement” in response to this backwardness of the Muslims you mentioned. His ambition was to enable the Muslims to walk abreast of the Hindus. But for this, and it is very important to note since it later developed into the dichotomy of Hindu-Muslim politics, Syed Ahmed emphasized that at this stage Muslims must stay away from politics and rather concentrate on their educational and economic progress.
Sir Syed’s Politics like of Mohammad Ali Jinnah can be divided into phases. The pre-1916 struggle of Sir Syed was not a struggle for Pakistan but for political survival of the UP Muslims in particular in the post-1857 period, during which the British became more anti-Hindustani and considerably pro-Punjabi.
Sir Syed Ahmad Khan , Nawab Mohammad Hayat of Wah , Sir Agha Khan , Iqbal and Mr Jinnah all were absolutely clear that the Muslim classes that they were leading wanted safety against Hindu domination and not freedom of India with a Hindu dominated government !
The grandsons or great grandsons of the loyal Punjabis of India as Sir Syed had called them in 1858.
The point is that Punjabis regard Punjab as the only real Pakistan while any Sindhi, Baloch, Pathan, Mohajir, Sariki, Kashmir who talks about provincial autonomy or basic rights is anti- Pakistan (Anti-Punjab) or an Indian or Jewish agent. I do not understand to this day that how can anyone with a sane and dispassionate mind compare Iqbal with Tagore when Tagore renounced knighthood because Indians were being killed and kicked and made to crawl in streets specially in Punjab, while Iqbal accepted it at the height of Khilafat Movement? But Iqbal is today projected in Pakistan as the sole man on the Punjabi quota! Liaqat Ali Khan is Quaid-e-Millat on the Hindustani Muslim quota! Every second Punjabi who claims to be an intellectual cannot digest his food till he writes one page in degrading Liaqat Ali Khan that accursed ‘Black Quail’ as Punjabis call Mohajirs in Pakistan. The average Punjabi describes the Bengalis as treacherous, Had those people been treacherous, dubious and like Ghulam Mohammad, Sikandar Mirza and Ayub could not have manipulated them in a totally unjust and arbitrary manner. The loyal Tiwanas and Noons and Awan, Maliks and Niazis were serving Ranjit Singh. The fact is that most of the Punjabi leadership we see today were “recruiting agents” for the British & Unionists…Punjabi’s never were part of the Hindustani-Pakistan History except siding with the British and killing independence loving Hindustanis in 1857.
(continued)
barristerakc says, "If were not for Shaheed Bhagat Singh and the brave patriots of Jillian Walla Bagh, almost ALL Punjabis would be considered traitors to India as far as helping the British is concerned,"
Barrister sahib, Why would Punjabis be considered traitors to India? Punjab was not even a part of India back then and as we know very well that even a country like India never existed before the arrival of the British. Punjab was an independent entity before it was annexed by the British India and Punjabis had no reason to show any loyalty towards India.
@kaami
Actually it is Mohajir who should be thankful that he was allowed to come and settle down in Pakistan. He was provided job, security and a bright future in the new country, otherwise the overall condition of their children today would be worse than that of a dalit if they had stayed in India and their children would be blowing thing up in Bombay today.
Punjabi Muslim Salariat outnumbered the UP Muslim Salariat when Pakistan came into being, it means that they were fully capable of running the country without paha likha Mohajir.
I don’t know exactly what is happening in Hyderi, last night my mother told me on the phone that MQM commandos are threatening Pathan shop keepers in Hyderi.
Great since we now know according to Punjabi Pig Odin’s statement that Jinnah, Liaqat Ali Khan, Sir Agha Khan and most of the mainstream local were opportunist thugs and the Unionist, Tawanas and “Pakhanas” – the Punjabi lot could have made it through anyway - LOL, that’s nothing new from a Punjabi man – that’s the real filth coming out something I point to my “moderate” friends.
Nawab Marri was right when he said, “I could live with a pig but not with a Punjabi”….and I know for sure how much the current governor Balochistan thinks about Punjabis too….
Sun Loo Bhaiyoo/Behanoo….Pehchaan loo un ko …..
Great since we now know according to Punjabi Odin’s statement that Jinnah, Liaqat Ali Khan, Sir Agha Khan and most of the mainstream local were opportunist thugs and the Unionist, Tawanas and “Pakhanas” – the Punjabi lot could have made it through anyway - LOL, that’s nothing new from a Punjabi man – that’s the real filth coming out something I point to my “moderate” friends.
Nawab Marri was right when he said, “I could live with a pig but not with a Punjabi”….and I know for sure how much the current governor Balochistan thinks about Punjabis too….
Sun Loo Bhaiyoo/Behanoo….Pehchaan loo un ko …..
kia pahchan lain ?in ko pahchana ja chukka hay.
World community forget iraq and afghanistan if the world wants to eliminate world terrorism in the name of islam they should concentrate with all force on Punjab in Pakistan as everyone in Punjab is favoring Talibans making Osama as hero and all the links with afghans lies in Punjab Example Hameed Guland the great leader of punjab Nawaz sharif took millions from OBL, and offcourse Imran Khan is siding with talibans and al qaeda.
If some of the posts here are any indication it seems Karachi would have outshone cities like London, Paris and New York had it not been for the bloody Punjabis. While no facts are provided but who needs them when a blind Freddy can see them like broad daylight that on the very day one, 14 August 1947, all Punjabis sat together to devise and sign a secret proclamation on a one point agenda. That is, to make the life miserable for Urdu-speakers and turn Karachi into an economically desolate, politically orphan and socially bankcorrupt city. This proclamation only goes on to speak the absolute obduracy of the Punjabi as this pledge shrugged off the fact that at the time the ill-fated province of the British India was suffering from the biggest forced migration/ethnic cleansing of human history.
Millions were pouring into the land, not in the search of economic opportunities armed with skills and education, but to save lives and find shelter. None of these millions of Punjabis tried to acquire the title of “muhajir” although they were displaced, shelterless, socked and penniless. These East Punjabi, putting aside hundreds of thousands of their kin lost during the upheaval of the Partition, got on with their lives, never once trying to rub in their “sacrifices” for this unfortunate country. Having lost the land of their ancestors, these East Punjabis decided to settle down mostly in West Punjabi cities, rather than villages, and started building their lives from scratch. It took them a brave struggle of a generation or two to find their feet, but now most professors, doctors, educators, top businessmen, media persons, etc of Paki Punjab come from these East Punjabis whose ancestors have crossed the controversial Redcliff Line with absolute bare hands, and bodies, in many instances. They are not Tiwanas, Niazis, Khars, Legharis, Maliks that run and dominate the Punjab of today but the educated Punjabis from cities. Now the Punjab is more identified by the sons of these Punjabi Muhajirs, (although they never claimed this tag despite having the right to the tag more than any other community), such as Nawaz Sharif, Sheikh Rasheed, Inzimam ul-Haq, and many others.
My Karachiite friend may find it surprising but many Urdu-speaking migrants also settled in the Punjabi cities and towns, albeit not as many as in Karachi. It is easy to feel discrimination and ethnic harassment when a community is in minority, which often manifests in institutionalising “siege-mentality” amongst the community. Such communities tend to become more Catholic than the Pope, so to speak. In the case of Urdu-speaking settlers it meant they should have become staunch Urdu-speakers language-wise, clinging to the customs of their forefather. No, it did not happen in the Punjab for the Urdu-speakers. These second and the third generations Punjabis, if I may, are indistinguishable from their fellow long-term Punjabis. They are Punjabis now first and foremost, having been born there they are sons of the soil. Despite having strong enclaves in places like Lahore, Multan, Bhakkar, Surgodha, Islamabad, the second and third generation Punjabis do not vote en masse for a political party, have no need to exert a separate identity. These “new” Punjabis are prospering economically, with their genetic streetwiseness mixing fruitfully with the general Punjabi “can-do” attitude.
Before I end my whine, may I say that it is true that the Punjabis (Sikhs and Muslims) generally sided with the British during the rebellion of 1857. Perhaps because the Punjab, until 1849 when the East India Company amalgamated it, had not been a political part of Mughal and British India for well over 200 years. Perhaps because it was a chance for Punjabis to get even with the UP/Bengal based rebel troops of the 32000-strong East India Company military who formed the backbone of the British forces that invaded the Punjab from 1845-49. That invasion fresh in the minds of Punjabis had ended in terminating the independence of the state of the Punjab. Not having been a part of the Mughal empire for hundred of years, the multi-ethnic and religiously tolerant Punjab of the 19th century had no affinity with the cause of the rebel from the UP and surrounds.
Meray bhaaiyo’n aur laRkiyo’n,
Sometimes I feel like throwing up after reading comments on KMB.
Just few points.
Sir Syed Ahmed Khan was very fond of people who lived in Panjab. He is the one to coin the term ‘Zindah dillaa’n -e- Panjab’.
He collected huge amounts of money from Panjab’s ordinary people for his school, and some of the earliest students of his institution were people from Panjab (please read Zikr-e-Aligarh, a book). It is the zamindars of Panjab who are real mother fuckers. While you see big landowners of UP and other parts of India starting colleges and universities, it is hard to find such an example in Panjab….may be I am uninformed here. Open to be corrected by others.
The second thing is that while it is true Panjabis sided with the East India Company during 1957, just 20/30 years ago it was the people of Bengal, UP, and Bihar, who had joined East India Company’s armies to annex Lahore and Peshawar.
Also, until British came, Panjab was really a geographical entity, not a political entity. For example, during Mughal times, you hear of Lahore province, Multan province, and Peshawar province. Britishers established Panjab as a politcal entity and gave Urdu/Hindi speaking areas west of Dehli to the new province….which eventually became Haryana after India’s independence.
There are lots of cities in UP where there was a population of Panjabi Muslims…such as in Dehli (some of them are now referred to as Dehli-Panjabi Saudagaraa’n - the people who actually speak aa-riyaa jaa-riyaa kind of Urdu, so watch out Panjabis before you make fun of these people, they are your own:-) )
Also, in Kanpur - most Muslims in leather business are panjabi origin.
Old Lucknow had a neighborhood called Panjabi-Toalah, just like Lucknow had Kashmiri Mohalla.
And, so on.
Therefore, no reason fighting over petty issues. Lets grow the pie, and divide it fairly. Not get invovled in ghunda gardi and shrink the pie.
And of course, I agree with Zardari’s idea to keep track of all elements moving to Karachi from Waziristan. Everyone is already registered with NADRA, now lets update their new addresses.
barristerakc said: Great since we now know according to Punjabi Pig Odin’s statement that Jinnah, Liaqat Ali Khan, Sir Agha Khan and most of the mainstream local were opportunist thugs and the Unionist, Tawanas and “Pakhanas” – the Punjabi lot could have made it through anyway
barrister beta aaram se zara araam se, samjha? And who told you that I am a Punjabi? Mods, how can you allow this kind of provocative language to be used against other interactors?
@ Odin
WOW !!!
I guess who give you right to call the Mohajirs as opportunists??
Muslim League faced Humiliating defeat in Punjab in 1945 elections Got it ??
If you are not punjabi then don’t try to be one.
@kaami
All landolords, from Scotland to Japan, are/were traitors who have/had only one thing in their mind, their own interest, and nothing else but their own interests. It would not be inappropriate to add here that just like the zamindaar of Punjab, UP zamindaar was also a MF. Is it not true that the UP zamindaar was the biggest ally of the British and what about his role that he played in the great Indian mutiny.
@khaled90
I don’t let me dictate from anybody, understand? I say whatever I want to say and I don’t need anybody’s permission. Come up with the counter arguments if you have any, otherwise just shut up and keep quiet.
@BALMA Gee, what an excellent post. A true geneological analysis. To support your argument, I can give example from my family, though they all migrated from UP in 1947-48 but there is one branch which traces its routes to Peshawar. Dilli being the Mughal capital was the pot purri of the whole India and beyond. As you have mentioned, Delhi Punjabi Saudagaraan are indeed from Punjab, perhaps somewhere near Multan or Chinniot. I can’t re-call off hand.
In Sindh I have encountered Sindhi Banarsi Cloth Makers whose origins can be traced back to Banaras. They were brought here before partition by the visionary Talpur’s of Riyasat-e-Khairpur who wanted to setup textile industry in their state. Unfortunately, Mr. Bhutto destroyed that industry as well.
@sceptic my rhetoric about mohajir’s /karachi, as I said earlier was to set the record straight, because some here were painting a picture of this city in 1947 as all setup with offices, furniture, buildings and banks waiting for the immigrants to come in and take their slots. It was not like that. It is also true that the worst of atrocities that were committed in that period happened in East Punjab. But that was all in the past.
Today, I think we are going hey wire, after consecutive atrocities committed on this nation by Bhutto and then Zia-ul-Haque, destroying the economic and ideological well being of this nation, creating a leadership vacuum being filled by the current useless lot. In these circumstances it would be foolish to aim for high ideals and goals. The best that we can do for the time being is to stay safe and fight off of the radical crack pots and religious fanatics. To achieve this, I will ally my self with anyone who has the guts to stand and fight against these dangerous snakes.
Love to be in company of you guys
@odin True this country was carved out to protect the intersts of the zamindar’s, nnawabs and wadera’s who have served the British well. But again, thats in the past. I was borned in Pakistan, I cannot change the history but I can influence the future with my insignificant contribution. I see an impending danger of exploding bodies ruining this country and I cant find any reason to support those, who in one way or the other try to justify / protect the perpetrators of the most heinous crimes in the regions history. Senselessly killing and destroying thousands of their own in support for a cause driven by hate and blood.
In my hero would be someone who could drag Mr. Osama, pulling his beard amidst chappal throwing crowds.
Barrister Sahib very true that, landed gentry of Punjab both Muslims & Hindus were first hoping for an independent Punjab but later when they realize that it wont materialize and faced with the radical plans by Nehru to implement aggressive land reforms force them to join hands with the Nawabs of Muslim league. Anyway, both Nawabs of UP / Jagirdaar’s of Punjab were not serious about Pakistan and would have been happy with some sort of autonomy / separate electorate, or whatever arrangement that would have allowed them to retain their lands and riches, but Mr. Nehru didn’t relent and Pakistan became the only way out. Mr. Jinnah was a good lawyer, he fought the case well, and after the fact, he had plans to follow Atta Turks model to setup a modern Muslim state, but soon after he was stopped short and put in his place.
Today the irony is that even Jaagirdaar’s are not calling the shots, in fact it’s the Mullah who was weakest link in the Wadera, Millitary and Molvi nexus, gaining more and more power, feeding on jahaalat and ideological confusion of our society.
I like Muttahida not because of the antics of it’s leader, but the clarity of its message and the commitment of its workers to serve and protect their people. The message is simple, work hard, develop and progress and fight to protect your way of life. Today its just a fight to preserve the bare essentials, but I have great expectations from Haider Rizvi, Faisal Sabzwari, Mustafa Kamal and Wasey Jalil etc. They are indeed a practical, presentable and a hard working lot, future looks good if they continue to utilize their talents, the way they are doing now. Believe me, when you compare, no one in any political party comes even a close second.
Hope the rest of Pakistan gets it before its too late, before the stupid ideologs swamp this country.
How dare people say that Upite Feudal did not sacrificed.
How could you forget Raja of Mahmudabad? He was the biggest feudal of UP…
Historical Records,
Contributed Rs.30 lacs to Muslim League when Quaid joined back (around 1937)
Donated Rs.1.3 caror to Muslim League for Pakistan…..
He also bought weapons to fight Indian Army in Kashmir and against the British worth millions of Rupees….
Eventually Raja Sahib donated all his lands to the peasants who lived on it…
(more then 6000 acres) …..
And eventually he lost all hope in Pakistan and left………
That’s a real Mohajir for you!
So what did Nawab Marri called Punjabis?
odin, when you disgrace my nation (the Mohajir nation) my ancestors, Mohammad Ali Jinnah you deserve more then a pig statement…
Marri is a terrorist. Glad that Mushuruff killed the other one i.e bugti.
I didn’t disgrace mohajirs or any other people, but whatever I said was true and Mahajers should be grateful to Pak and its people for providing them shelter, jobs and other opportunities. Those who cannot come up with counter arguments do usually resort to slurs and name-calling.
I’ve told you already that I am not a Punjabi and there is nothing that we can call as a mohajir nation and neither a khanzeer like you can ever be their representative. Now go and hump Marri in his cave, he seems to have a fondness for a khanzeer like you.
@barrister
I didn’t disgrace mohajirs or any other people, but whatever I said was true and Mahajers should be grateful to Pak and its people for providing them shelter, jobs and other opportunities. Those who cannot come up with counter arguments do usually resort to slurs and name-calling.
I’ve told you already that I am not a Punjabi and there is nothing that we can call as a mohajir nation and neither a khanzeer like you can ever be their representative. Now go and hump Marri in his cave, he seems to have a fondness for a khanzeer like you.
@Odin: your writings show how immature you are, its also show your lack on knowledge on the subject you are writing on, further, it also lacks a show of a bit of research which everybody does to prove the point they are making.
Now coming towards, the derogatory remarks you made on barrister, this shows your attitude towards other members of society. Let me clear a point that Mohajirs or Urdu speaking people did more than the natives to create this country, if you have an independent country that is only because their sacrifices, how many families or people you know, personally, who are natives of existing lands and were living here since stone age and have lost any loved one ………….. I can bet your answer will be ‘NONE’.
Let me tell you, I wont give account of anyone else, my grand father was in British military, since he was an avid follower of Sir Syed Ahmed Khan. Later he resigned from military and joined Muslim League and was part of group which brought many many trains to Pakistan carrying Mohajirs. For his country, he fought three wars before he got retired from Pakistan Army. Except for my father everyone in my family has worked for army or law enforcement agencies, and guess what!!! except for my mother none of them was ever posted in Karachi.
So please stop disgracing the people who have sacrificed more than anyone for making of this country and have worked hard to keep this dream alive. I respect your thinking, but its expression should remain in decent boundaries ………………
(Note: by term ‘natives’ I mean the people who were staying on the existing lands of Pakistan, much before the arrival of mughals or in other words, Islam.)
salam tzaidi sahib, kheriat se hen aap?
Thank you Sir for sharing your discourse upon the creation of Pakistan and the sacrifices made by Mohajirs for this county. Your grandfather’s anecdotal evidence was really heart breaking, now every Punjabi, Pathan, Sindhi, Baloch, Kashmiri and Seraiki should be grateful to Mohajirs for creating this country for them who had already been living here for thousands of years and most of them anyway had no desire for a separate country because they didn’t feel threatened from the Hindu minority.
By the way, what would have happened only if the Zamindaars of Punjab had not jumped on the bandwagon of AIML at the last moment, and the Pathans of FATA had not voted in favour of Pakistan and the Sindhis and Bengalis had not struggled for the creation of this country for such a long time? Is it not true that the first person who had proposed the creation of Pak was a punjabi?
Yaar zaidi sahib, you know exactly that we know how many sacrifices were made by the Mohajirs for the creation of Pakistan, you can fool a Pathan or a Punjabi but no me. Being one of them I know Mohajirs and their sacrifices very well. The biggest proponent for the creation of a separate country was the Muslsim Salariat of UP and the majority of them belong to the Ashraf Tabqa, that Asfraafs and their racist leaders like Syed A. Khan never gave a fuck about Azlafs who were in overwhelming majority and who have been the biggest loser.
Economic fawaids were the biggest reason why these Mohajirs chose to came to Pak, not the love for this country or because of the religious reasons.
And as far as that khanzeer barrister of la loo khet is concerned, you better read again who first abused whom, ok?
@ odin aka doctor
Suddenly you become Mohajir ?
LOL
hahahaha
@ KMB Speacially Urdu speaks.
This odin show his true colr even calling the great Sir Syed Ahmed Khan Racist ,
Odin i guess from your posts its quite obvious that Pakistan should be broken as the punjabi Pathans and other don’t want this seperate state for muslims ??
yes khaled bhai! Yes, I call him a racist. Now would you also retaliate by calling me a Punjabi Pig?
And d0ct0r seems to be a very reasonable person. Unlike Altaf’s lundas who bear grudges against all non Urdu Speakers, he at least only criticizes MQM and quaid e fasaad. D0ct0r’s arguments are not distorted and he backs them up with facts, two important things that Altaf’s lundaas lack.
Khaled bhai do you really think that any non-Mohajir will ever masquerade as Mohajir, even on the net?
Pujabis (Punjabi landlord) and Pathans had decided to support Pakistan movement, albeit at a very later stage, that’s why Pak became a reality. If one day they decide to get rid of it then there will be no Pakistan any more.
No need to call you anything as people on this blog knows who are you
My dear odin!! You can not mislead people by throwing ashraf-azlaf theory, or what ever name you want to give this lame theory of yours. Many cities in Uttar Pardesh, namely Ghaziabad, Luknow, Allahabad and Breily, still have muslim majority. If they were so eager then they would have moved here in Pakistan during / after partition.
Yes, you are 110% right the natives (aka Punjabi, Pathan and Balouchi) joined the AIML pretty late – the reason was simple that they wanted everything for themselves and a full share of pie. You tell me, be it Punjabis or Sirakies, Balooch aur Pakhtuns, who hasn’t demanded autonomous region for themselves, separated from Pakistan. If they made the same demand being in ‘United India\, then they would have met the same fate as Kashmir’s. – its no rocket since, what was the easier route for them and who is most faithful to Pakistan.
So please refrain from spreading hatred against the true Pakistanis – The Mohajirs & great leaders like Sir Syed Ahmed Khan - start using logics when you think.